Law and Med

[hsaid84]

Hey everyone, have a question here. I will be applying to medical school next year and as a backup plan, I'll also be applying to law. Now suppose I don't get into med next year, but I get into law and begin attending. How will it look the following year if I apply to medical school again? Will they look favourably on another profession being dedicated enough to medicine to attempt an application cycle? Will they perhaps look at it as diverging interests and thus a jack of all trades, king of none scenario? Or thirdly, will they just not give a crap and I'll be just another applicant, but one who happnes to be in lawschool?

 

Thanks in advance.

[thehumanmacbook]

Yeah it's fine; I've heard of people doing that before. One note though - say you don't get in next cycle, you may need to include your Law 1 year marks for the cycle afterwards since law is considered a UG degree.

 

It might come up in the interview, but pre-interview it shouldn't matter.

[hsaid84]

Yeah it's fine; I've heard of people doing that before. One note though - say you don't get in next cycle, you may need to include your Law 1 year marks for the cycle afterwards since law is considered a UG degree.

 

It might come up in the interview, but pre-interview it shouldn't matter.

 

Do you think it'll give me any advantage though?

 

And you bring up a good point, my GPA may be affected if I attend law school. I will consider this factor.

[Adversary]

No. My classmate thought the same thing with dentistry and considering he got H's in the medicine courses we had with medical students. He thought he proved to them that he is capable of medical school, but it didn't matter. He didn't get in till a number of reapplications later.

 

Do you think it'll give me any advantage though?

 

And you bring up a good point, my GPA may be affected if I attend law school. I will consider this factor.

[hsaid84]

No. My classmate thought the same thing with dentistry and considering he got H's in the medicine courses we had with medical students. He thought he proved to them that he is capable of medical school, but it didn't matter. He didn't get in till a number of reapplications later.

 

I dunno what H's are but I'll guess they're good. I thought it may help me if I attend lawschool, but if it doesn't, I won't bother with it. Rather boost my EC's for a year.

[Adversary]

H's mean honours. Basically, top of the class.

 

And no, going to law school doesn't make you that much more special.

 

I dunno what H's are but I'll guess they're good. I thought it may help me if I attend lawschool, but if it doesn't, I won't bother with it. Rather boost my EC's for a year.

[future_doc]

Having both law and medical degrees is fantastic, there are a few such people who are licenced to pracitce both. So, if you do get into law first, it is worthwhile completing the degree and becoming a member of the Bar before entering medicine. Depending upon the prof, you may not get As, there is one prof at U/O who won't give a grade above B+ as he feels nobody is entitled to an A, although he is the exception.

 

Moreover, your plan is sound, even if you go to law school and then apply to med school while there. Should you not get into med school after 2 applications, you keep trying but are preparing for another profession. BTW, since 2008, there has been a serious change with lawfirms, failures, mergers, and less hiring, which has forced many to do LL.M.s due to the economic realities.

[jerkstore]

This is the kind of guy who's trying to become a Doctor purely for the prestige or cash, because obviously a lawyer is the next logical step.

[future_doc]

high intellect, critical thinking, problem solving under time constraints, lifelong learning, teamwork, there is much in common for both professions in my view.

[jerkstore]

high intellect, critical thinking, problem solving under time constraints, lifelong learning, teamwork, there is much in common for both professions in my view.

 

Well I don't know about the lifelong learning and the teamwork but I'll agree with the rest.

 

Not so sure about the problem solving or high intellect if it's anything other than criminal law.

 

Just my opinion.

[future_doc]

Unforotunately, in the legal profession, incompetents can and do thrive with very high incomes, whereas this is highly unlikely to occur in the medical profession. In almost every field of law, problem solving ability is mandatory as is anticipating the other side's moves, it is like guerilla warfare or chess where on the surface everybody is nice.

 

Criminal law is good for those who do white collar crime where the lawyer is not at risk and earns his fee regardless of jail time of accused. But dealing with lowlife criminals is another matter where they hyave been known to rub out lawyers for losing a case, there was a famous example decades ago in Montreal where a criminal lawyer was killed after the g/f of a mobster lost a case and was sent to jail!

[Robin Hood]

You may get consideration for your degree at UofC and McGill, but most of the others won't care.

[cheech10]

Unforotunately, in the legal profession, incompetents can and do thrive with very high incomes, whereas this is highly unlikely to occur in the medical profession.

 

I think you have it backwards. Law income is much more dependent on performance, especially at large firms. Virtually no lay person knows if their physician is doing an adequate job; their perception is much more dependent on MD personality, support staff interactions, etc. Most people complain of lack of access to physicians, rude support staff, or long waiting room times, not failure to diagnose/treat. Factor in a proscribed fee schedule for physicians, and you have the framework of a system where income is essentially independent from performance.

[future_doc]

I think you have it backwards. Law income is much more dependent on performance, especially at large firms. Virtually no lay person knows if their physician is doing an adequate job; their perception is much more dependent on MD personality, support staff interactions, etc. Most people complain of lack of access to physicians, rude support staff, or long waiting room times, not failure to diagnose/treat. Factor in a proscribed fee schedule for physicians, and you have the framework of a system where income is essentially independent from performance.

 

Not exactly as you say. "Performance" is judged by billings! And the incompetents take case to court and lose, go to Appeal Court and lose and to the Supremem Court and are turned down or lose. However, the real loser is the client as he is paying big bucks for this incompetent lawyer who earns close to $1M at a top firm due strictloy to his incompetence. These cases never should have gone to court, but he is a good golfer, has an attractive wife and is personable. I personally know a couple of such lawyers. Clients don't know better.

 

In our profession, incompetence can lead to death or serious medical problems or complications, so it is noticed sooner and corrective action is taken. The lay person wants to stay alive and get better, this is his criteria to judge his physician.

 

 

What? The medical profession has its fill of incompetents, same as any other profession. Some of them even get to fairly high positions (promote them to get them off the wards).

 

It may be hard to get in but the system is far from perfect and that is to say nothing about IMGs or older doctors who got in during easier times when the most important part of an application was whether you could pay for it.

 

Sometimes it actually keeps me up at night worrying about the standard of care some people receive and just how easy it is to keep moving forward once you get accepted into undergrad.

 

Fair enough! I know one incompetent doctor. Occasionally a patient does die due to his lack of care but the family doesn't see it and he focuses upon creating as much billings as possible. He is untrustworthy to wash my car.

At least we will know what doctors to trust with our loved ones.

[hsaid84]

Having both law and medical degrees is fantastic, there are a few such people who are licenced to pracitce both. So, if you do get into law first, it is worthwhile completing the degree and becoming a member of the Bar before entering medicine. Depending upon the prof, you may not get As, there is one prof at U/O who won't give a grade above B+ as he feels nobody is entitled to an A, although he is the exception.

 

Moreover, your plan is sound, even if you go to law school and then apply to med school while there. Should you not get into med school after 2 applications, you keep trying but are preparing for another profession. BTW, since 2008, there has been a serious change with lawfirms, failures, mergers, and less hiring, which has forced many to do LL.M.s due to the economic realities.

 

 

That was the plan. It would provide me a backup in case medical takes too long to get into. I don't want to waste away for 3-4-5 years in case I don't get in. I already have the LSAT score to easily get me into any Canadian school so I thought it would be prudent to apply to law as well.

[hsaid84]

This is the kind of guy who's trying to become a Doctor purely for the prestige or cash, because obviously a lawyer is the next logical step.

 

 

Or because I wrote the LSAT and got in the 99th percentile. I think that makes law a logical step, not whatever it is you're talking about. Goodluck with that type of reasoning though, I can see you'll do well on the verbal section of the MCAT or the LSAT if you ever write either.

[hsaid84]

Well I don't know about the lifelong learning and the teamwork but I'll agree with the rest.

 

Not so sure about the problem solving or high intellect if it's anything other than criminal law.

 

Just my opinion.

 

What utter gold you spew. Please, keep posting.

[hsaid84]

Unforotunately, in the legal profession, incompetents can and do thrive with very high incomes, whereas this is highly unlikely to occur in the medical profession. In almost every field of law, problem solving ability is mandatory as is anticipating the other side's moves, it is like guerilla warfare or chess where on the surface everybody is nice.

 

Criminal law is good for those who do white collar crime where the lawyer is not at risk and earns his fee regardless of jail time of accused. But dealing with lowlife criminals is another matter where they hyave been known to rub out lawyers for losing a case, there was a famous example decades ago in Montreal where a criminal lawyer was killed after the g/f of a mobster lost a case and was sent to jail!

 

I dont' know what you're talking about here. Law is a difficult profession because of it's technical nature. Everything is down to the most minute detail. You have to know your profession inside out or you will get wasted in a courtroom or a negotiation. Patent lawyers for example have to figure out 18 ways to Sunday to protect a patent. It's not a field where idiots can strive becuase if you mess up once or twice, everyone int he field will know and you will have trouble gaining clients.

 

On another note, in medicine you fnid some VERY stupid people in terms of common sense. They are book smart to the bone. It's not bad if you need research or information, but utterly useless in terms of the practical applications their job requires. Lawyers are much more "street smart" in general than doctors.

[jerkstore]

Damn even when you include "that's just my opinion", you still get scolded here! Though I shouldn't be surprised, nobody on here has ever said anything without at least two people disagreeing. For some reason you people think they're similar because they're both "challenging" and "I was in the 99th percentile on the LSAT".

 

My point was the jobs, the actual activities and knowledge involved are in no way related, and that OP is only interested in being a Lawyer immediately after a Doctor, because it's a "high up profession". As the saying goes, "I could have been a Doctor or a Lawyer". I never understood why Lawyer'ing is considered on the same level. I think research work in the medical or health sciences would be the next logical step, however if there's one thing the world needs - it's more lawyers.

But have it your way, being a Neurologist or an estate lawyer pushing paper all day are very similar activities, and in no way are related to one another purely due to prestige and money.

 

I bet you'd score well on the dental admissions test, or other health care profession test; why aren't those next on your list? A dentist is just as prestigious as a lawyer, and you'd make more money. Lawyers don't make as much as they used to, probably because there's so goddamn many of them.

 

Of course this is all assuming that OP wanted to be a Doctor in the first place for reasons other than the prestige and money. If that's not the case, then there is no logical next step.

 

[dazzle]

Damn even when you include "that's just my opinion", you still get scolded here! Though I shouldn't be surprised, nobody on here has ever said anything without at least two people disagreeing.

 

Do you think that saying "just my opinion" exempts you from saying intelligent things or what? If that's the case, don't bother posting. I find it acceptable that people that take this lame route be shown up for it. Your comment about someone interesting in med and law being driven by cash and prestige is retarded to say the least.

[jerkstore]

Do you think that saying "just my opinion" exempts you from saying intelligent things or what? If that's the case, don't bother posting. I find it acceptable that people that take this lame route be shown up for it. Your comment about someone interesting in med and law being driven by cash and prestige is retarded to say the least.

 

It's fine to find them both interesting. I just see a lot of this "well I can't be a Doctor so I guess I'll try Lawyer" a lot, and I find it's usually for the wrong reasons. OP may very well find writing up contracts for a corporation (or any of the law practices outside of criminal) just as interesting as medical science, and more so than any of the other health care occupations closely related to a Physician (PA, Dentist etc.)

[dazzle]

word it that way then... don't be afraid to say things modestly if you are going on speculations

[jerkstore]

word it that way then... don't be afraid to say things modestly if you are going on speculations

 

I guess I went on the assumption that we've seen this a lot around here, that it's a fairly well known criticism, and that other folks would quickly back me up.

 

I suppose I just want OP to know that (again in my opinion) practicing medicine and practicing law (in most forms) are nothing alike (besides very broad similarities like "challenging"), and that if he truly has an interest in the medical field perhaps he should try some of the other closely related professions. This is typically the practice we see around here, going to a related field in health care which will satisfy many of the interests in practicing medicine, which is why the sudden jump to lawyer sparked my skepticism.

 

If working in law is truly his next direct passion after being a physician then all power to him, I just can't help but get this sneaking suspicion that he's gunning solely for the "most reputable" jobs, which as we know, is not the pathway to happiness.

[hsaid84]

Damn even when you include "that's just my opinion", you still get scolded here! Though I shouldn't be surprised, nobody on here has ever said anything without at least two people disagreeing. For some reason you people think they're similar because they're both "challenging" and "I was in the 99th percentile on the LSAT".

 

My point was the jobs, the actual activities and knowledge involved are in no way related, and that OP is only interested in being a Lawyer immediately after a Doctor, because it's a "high up profession". As the saying goes, "I could have been a Doctor or a Lawyer". I never understood why Lawyer'ing is considered on the same level. I think research work in the medical or health sciences would be the next logical step, however if there's one thing the world needs - it's more lawyers.

But have it your way, being a Neurologist or an estate lawyer pushing paper all day are very similar activities, and in no way are related to one another purely due to prestige and money.

 

I bet you'd score well on the dental admissions test, or other health care profession test; why aren't those next on your list? A dentist is just as prestigious as a lawyer, and you'd make more money. Lawyers don't make as much as they used to, probably because there's so goddamn many of them.

 

Of course this is all assuming that OP wanted to be a Doctor in the first place for reasons other than the prestige and money. If that's not the case, then there is no logical next step.

 

 

 

All this sounded like excuses to cover up what you said initially about me wanting to be a doctor for superficial reasons. I stopped reading after you took the story on that road with claims about what I was saying and how you were misunderstood.

 

Goodluck.

[jerkstore]

All this sounded like excuses to cover up what you said initially about me wanting to be a doctor for superficial reasons. I stopped reading after you took the story on that road with claims about what I was saying and how you were misunderstood.

 

Goodluck.

 

What's next on your list, politics?