Do I have a high chance to get admitted to UQ or any other medical school?

[e46devil]

Hi there

 

I am a recent MSc graduate from a program is consisted of both course work and research work. I have achieved 79% or 6.75/7 from my graduate study. But, my undergraduate gpa is only 73%. During my graduate study, I have two publication, and I have received a couple of research awards as well. And, I am planning to focus on my MCAT this year since I am working on my paper now. For possible future residency, I may go back to North America or Hong Kong since I am also from Hong Kong.

So, if I do really well on my MCAT, do you guys think that I may have some chances to get admitted?

 

Please feel free to leave some comments since I am making decision this year for doing MD or Phd.

 

THANKS

[marble30]

A bit late but I figured getting an answer later is probably better than no answer at all?

 

Anyways, admission to Australia is based mostly on MCAT scores with your GPA merely serving as a cut-off (so once you're over their requirement, they don't look at it anymore). To be safe, you should probably try to score a 30+.

 

Also, it is notoriously hard to secure residency or any medical job in Hong Kong as a foreign trained doctor. From what I've heard, pass rates for the HKMLE hover somewhere around 10% since the medical council board is trying to keep the number of foreign trained doctors in HK low.

[leviathan]

I've heard some Australian grads end up going to Singapore for residency - any truth to that being a viable option?

[ItsME]

I've heard some Australian grads end up going to Singapore for residency - any truth to that being a viable option?

 

The Australian medical degrees are highly regarded in Singapore. It is not uncommon for singaporian nationals to complete medical education in Australia and return after graduation. If you are asking about Canadian citizens. I am not sure. Although there are now ACGME accredited residency programs in Singapore (along with Qatar and UAE).

[rswim]

The Australian schools require foreign graduates to 1.) Be able to breath 2.) Have a pulse.

 

There really aren't any standards - I think 24 MCAT or something like that.

 

I've known a few people who struggled through an undergraduate degree at a mediocre university who got into UQ med as an international.

 

Australian schools are great (for Australians - who worked hard to get in) but even the best schools in the world can't produce top notch physicians from mediocre students from wealthy families).

[leviathan]

Does your performance in an undergraduate degree which has absolutely zero relevance to medicine determine if you will be a good doctor? Does having a low GPA identify who the "mediocre" student is? Sure, there's some minor correlation between undergrad GPA and medical school, but it doesn't make a big difference. There's good literature that supports that.

 

In reality it's actually the minimum standards and evaluation system set out by the medical school and the ability of students to exceed those standards. A school with higher standards will have a higher mean on a bell curve, although likely still the same number of 'top notch doctors' as you put it. Unfortunately those several standard deviations to the right will likely not have anything that you could have used in an admissions application to identify them in advance.

 

Have you looked at what the standards are at Canadian vs. Australian medical schools? What constitutes a minimum score for a pass? How many evaluations are actually given? How many second chances do the weakest students get before they're expelled? Those are probably better questions to ask, especially in a system admitting students under false pretenses that they're somehow the most qualified for medical school using less than ideal criteria. I don't have a better solution than using undergrad GPA and MCAT, but I also don't think you should paint Australian medical students with the same brush. Some of them will be your colleagues in the future.

[Edict]

Hi there

 

I am a recent MSc graduate from a program is consisted of both course work and research work. I have achieved 79% or 6.75/7 from my graduate study. But, my undergraduate gpa is only 73%. During my graduate study, I have two publication, and I have received a couple of research awards as well. And, I am planning to focus on my MCAT this year since I am working on my paper now. For possible future residency, I may go back to North America or Hong Kong since I am also from Hong Kong.

So, if I do really well on my MCAT, do you guys think that I may have some chances to get admitted?

 

Please feel free to leave some comments since I am making decision this year for doing MD or Phd.

 

THANKS

 

Have you considered HKU or CUHK? I know someone who graduated from undegrad who went to HKU for medical school. Its 5 years long and i believe he is currently in the process of writing the USMLEs. HKU is a very good university.

[OzTREKK]

G'day everyone,

 

So sorry that I have been absent from the community for quite some time.

 

O.K., to add to some of the above points, as leviathan pointed out, the minimum entry requirements to Australian medical school are quite similar to that of a Canadian medical school.

 

I run comparative statistics each year on average admission statistics for each cohort at the University of Toronto and the University of Queensland.

 

And both are very close and comparable.

 

Obviously admission to UQ, Sydney, Melbourne, Monash, will be lower to UofT simply because it is a supply and demand issue. There are so many Canadians applying to UofT and there are so few positions. There are naturally going to be fewer international applicants applying to Australian medical schools.

 

Please don't get confused, whether Canada, Australia, the US or anywhere else for that matter, admission into any program is purely based on the supply of places in the program vs the demand by those applying. The greater the demand and the fewer the supply of places naturally you will have a higher admission average. That is simply a given.

 

I hope that I did not demystify the admissions process for some, but that is really what it comes down to. I sit and meet with Deans of Canadian medical schools quite regularly each year, and time and time again, this is what is brought up...supply vs demand.

 

Because the demand for places in Canada outstrips the supply of places in medical schools by 10:1, medical schools in Canada have needed to rely on other admissions factors, such as personal statements, references, experience, etc.

 

All these factors are simply 'demand management tools'. Again this is verbatim from one Canadian medical school dean, who I will obviously not name.

 

In Australia, the admissions standards are different. As many of you may have seen, Australian medical schools (except a very few), only take in to account your GPA in your most recently completed degree, and your MCAT score. Some still use the interview as an admissions criteria.

 

The reason why Australian medical schools don't use anything other than GPA and MCAT (at graduate entry programs) (and interview for some) is for two main reasons.

 

1. How can you empirically assess extra-curricular data? As well, what many of the Australian medical schools found was that some students were brought up in very privileged circles, and as such had great access to clinical rounds, top physicians, and great references, which created an uneven playing field.

 

So they abolished the requirement for extra-curricular data, as they could not effectively or efficiently assess it and students were spending their time ticking boxes on a list of the things they accomplished not because they wanted to, but because they thought it would give them a better chance of admission.

 

2. Academic aptitude is key. What the Australian universities are most concerned about is academic aptitude. Will you pass the course?

 

At the end of the day, the study of medicine is rigorous. It is hard, long and tough. Do you have the academic aptitude to be able to handle the rigours of the course?

 

When I meet with my students each year in Australia, they all state how challenging and 'full on' the programs are. That is just the study of medicine.

 

So above are the reasons why the admissions standards are different between Canada and Australia. So for many, I recommend not to read too much in to them, as they are different as there are different philosophies at play.

 

And finally on this issue, if the students that Australian medical schools were admitting were substandard then they would not only not pass medical school, and they would not secure a residency in Canada, the US or an internship in Australia.

 

The dropout rate among international students at Australian medical schools is lower than the dropout rate for Australian students, for obvious reasons.

 

So it is best to pass comment and evaluate at the end of something...the result more so than at the start or the beginning.

 

In relation to your grades e46devil, UQ will only considered your most recently completed undergraduate results, as long as you have completed them in the past 10 years. So, unfortunately, your GPA from your MSc will not be considered. I have the admissions calculator here in the office and I can calculate whether or not your undergraduate results will meet the UQ minimum standard. Just PM me and we can go from there.

 

Now, regarding leviathan's comment in relation to Singaporean residencies, there are many Australian medical graduates that go to Singapore to complete their internships, prior to moving on to their residencies. The Singapore government actively recruits Australian medical graduates, as Singapore has a very dire doctor shortage and a very aging population.

 

So there are a number of students from Singapore that study medicine in Australia and many go back to Singapore. There are also many Australian graduates that go to Singapore because of the incentives by the Singapore government.

 

I have not heard of many Canadians doing this as they have all either matched in Canada, the US or stayed in Australia to undertake their internship, thus far.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Matt