applying at age 36: anyone else done it? am I competitive?

[Guest drcave]

I was always someone who did well in school but never really planned in a path in life, although I did consider medicine and even wrote the MCAT 10 years ago but never applied. Instead I did a MSc in Biology, got married, worked for the government for a couple of years in a forestry research lab as a technician and then quit and started my own ecotourism business.

 

Although I love ecotourism, I just can't make enough money to support the family my wife and I want to start, so it's time to fall back on plan B, medicine. I have two questions for those in the know out there:

 

1) Is there anyone out there who is going through medschool at the same time as starting a family? Do you think it is manageable or do you feel like you are cheating your kids of valuable time with their parent, and how much time are you able to devote to your family in a week?

 

2) As an older applicant am I still competitive for those precious spots? I know my recent volunteer experience needs some beefing up and that I'll have to retake the MCAT. About me:

Age: 34

BSc Biology 1995 with 85% overall average

MSc Biology 2001 A's and A-'s in coursework

1996 MCAT scores Verbal 12, Biological 13, Physical 14, Writing O

Volunteer experience:

1995: Therapeutic Riding volunteer, KW hospital volunteer

1996: Youth Challenge International (3 months in Costa Rica)

2004-2006 Director, Canadian Cave Conservancy

Director Vancouver Island North Visitors Association

Passion in Life: Cave exploration and mapping

 

I really appreciate any feedback.

 

Edit, Oh yeah UBC or Calgary would be my top choices since they are closest to caving areas and I can't live without caving.

[Guest kayak22]

Hey ther drcave,

I just spent a while typing out a message and cyberspace ate it all up. Here we go again...shortened version. I am in the same boat. I did my undergrad in outdoor pursuits, worked a few years then went back and did my Masters in Physiotherapy. I came back and got married, started a business and have worked several years. I have now decided that I want to apply to medicine. So...with several years behind me, I too am getting close to wanting a family, and have had the same thoughts! Having said this, I know people who have gone through the program and have managed well, and I do believe that with family and friend support that it is completely possible -not always easy....but possible!!

 

One thing to consider, is that you are able to take Maternity/Paternity during residency while getting paid (EI) as you are paid as an employee while during your residency. this is not so when you are working as a contractor -which you are all to familiar with I am sure with respect to your owning your own business.

 

Calgary is great because of not only the mountains, but also b/c the years are 3 instead of 4!

 

Do check how long your MCAT is valid as I believe that it may only be valid for 3-5 years? I may be completely off the mark -but do look into it, otherwise you may have to write it again -sigh. writings take place April and August I think. Check the U of C website to see what they say.

 

Cheers and good luck.

 

...fellow "older" outdoor lover wanting to get into med.

[Guest drcave]

Thanks Kayak,

 

I didn't realize that calgary was a 3 year not 4 year u8 ttttttttttttttt oops that was my pet rat typing..... program. that makes it very attractive for a geezer like myself. Yes the mountains are awesome, and I even have some family there so that would make things easier78888888880 rat again...

 

I'm registered to retake the MCAT april 22. I can't believe its 16 years since I took some of my electives! God time flies! I've done some asking around and it doesn't seem like being a bit older affects our chances of getting accepted.

 

That is a good idea with the paternity leave during residency, something I never considered. I've never been on EI in my life but maybe I will need a break then. Of course thats putting the cart before the horse, getting in is top priority now. I know its much tougher to get into an out of province university so UBC is probably my best chance but who knows maybe we'll end up in the same class at UC and can climb a mountain together or explore a cave. Cheers.

[Guest kayak22]

Hey drcave,

well it sounds like things are well under way for you already! I am glad to hear about other people in the same boat and the more I have chatted with friends and others who have gone through the program, the more that I find that many of the students are older and a few have kidos!

 

Yes, U of C is 3 years (in fact I think that it starts in August and then ends 2.75 years later in April ish.). Also, the students who get in out of province are granted an interview based on an algorithm comprised of GPA, MCAT scores etc. I can't remember it all but here is the website, check it out. admissions.myweb.med.ucalgary.ca/

For non-Alberta Applicants

 

 

 

""""Non-Albertans will be rank-ordered on the basis of an algorithm regression formula based on the grade point average in the best two full-time years and the scores achieved in the verbal reasoning and biological sciences sections of the MCAT.

 

 

 

Ranking Score Formula = 62.517* (gpa) + 12.122* (VR) + 6.757* (BS)

 

* constant numbers"""""

I can't remember the cut off for this year, but look on the Calgary forum to get an idea, I know that a few people posted some info about this, or better yet, email/call the university to see where you stand (I think it was somewhere in early to mid 400s but don't quote me).

 

 

 

Just FYI with maternity/paternity; With EI, that is how most people take time off to have kids if they are being paid as an Employee in their job (as opposed to a contractor as I am while working as a physio and I imagine you are too as a business owner). A mother can now take up to 1 year and be paid by the government, It works out to be 55% of her salary to a maximum of $413 a week. (depending on your family's salary at the time (being less than 25,000ish), the weekly amount could be higher). The father can also take time off for paternity leave and receive funds for this also. The total time taken off between the parents will have to be no more than a combined 50 weeks though. Here is the Gov. of Canada website that will provide you with more info.

 

www.hrsdc.gc.ca/asp/gatew...s=tyt#much

 

I know this as I currently own and run my own business and am therefore exempt from having to pay EI. I knew that if I stayed the course, I wouldn't be able to capitalize on the EI benefits when off with a baby. Also, there is a waiting period - you have to have worked 600 hours within the last 52 weeks before being eligible (so a 50-60 hour work week as a resident makes for at least 10-12 weeks work before eligible for PATERNAL leave). I thought I knew some people who went through this and they needed to have worked 6 months before being eligible. But read the website to get more information. Interestingly enough, once you are a doctor, and not a resident anymore, you are most likely going to be a contractor (especially if you work family practice) and then will be exempt from EI all over again...so in a very strange and twisted way, having kids during residency works out in that favor.

 

Well doesn't this email sound like all I have is baby on the brain! Not really. I have decided that I want to have a family and a career and needed to know about how I could go about it and make sure that I could not only provide for my family, but also make sure that the family gets the parent time that it will undoubtedly need!

 

Like I said before, great family and friend support, a smart head on the shoulders, an ability to stay grounded and well rounded and an insatiable desire to manage time well makes this all possible!!

 

Here's looking to some mountain climbin' and schoolin'!

Cheers!

[Guest ssc427]

I am 29 and will be starting medical school with my wife and 2 kids next year either in Canada (hopefully) or in NYC where I have an acceptance already (or possibly Boston if I get in). I figure med school won't be any harder than my PhD.

 

I too am an addicted climber so was gunning for Calgary but got rejected pre-interview due to the silly OOP formula. But I do have interviews at UBC (top choice - love Squamish/Cheak canyon and have family support there) and UofA in the west and a few other Canadian schools in the east.

 

Also - to save you looking the UofC cutoff was 449 using the above formula for OOP folks.

 

When you have a family another factor comes into the mix when choosing your school - what are the family services like? At Calgary they are awsome. Less so at UBC and UofA, but still not tragic. You'll want a nice family complex where your significant other can meet other people in the same boat and form a support network. To be honest the best family support is at the American schools I've interviewed at this year, but I'd rather be in Canada.

[Guest anatomist]

Hi Doc Spelunkereedoo

 

Same boat,

 

I'm 32, finished PhD, teaching, 2 children from first marriage and a new baby here (8 months old) I'm thinking of going back to apply. I would say by all means don't even consider age as a factor. The admissions committee certainly should not be.

As long as you have the financial resources and family support (a biggy! Certainly something deserving of mention in the interview. No man is an island) I don't see why it should stop you.

 

Good luck and keep in touch.

 

Cheers,

 

Kevin

[Guest drcave]

Thanks for all the feedback. It makes me look forward to getting in and making new friends, an aspect of medical school that I had not even considered in any way. Sure it will be tough, sure it will time consuming, but I forgot that it is not a solitary experience. Thanks for helping me realize this and setting my resolve to do what it takes to get in.

[Guest kayak22]

Drcave ...aka Spleelunkeredoo

...love that name!! Anyway, I was reading up on the CaRMS website about parental/maternity leave and it had some more information. Just thought I would let you know.

 

Hey! I know what you mean about making new friends in school. With these types of degrees (not that it doesn't happen elsewhere, cause it does) the people are so varied and typically have such amazing life experiences and stories to tell that it makes for a very colourful experience!

Keep us posted on how things are doing!

 

Good luck!

[Guest housemouse]

Don't weat it, I am in the same boat, except haven't taken the MCATs yet. For the past decade, I have done Surgical orderly, Trauma Medic, EMT-ER, Casualty scouting-Iraq/battlefield EMT. Blood, gore, body parts, sowing, fixing, rescucitating...you name it. The med schools would definetly ask why so late and why not something else? So, friend, have a good answer ready and you will be in the same race as everyone else. I find taking care of my two toddlers and studying my brains off for the MCATs to be quite rehearsing. That is what med schools will ask you for-MULTITASKING.

Best

[Guest Mimicat65]

Hey all,

 

Dr. Cave, your stats look pretty competitive to me - too bad you can't use that mcat but I'm sure you'll rock it again.

 

I am in med2 and started at age 38. I have children, husband, business and life outside of school. There are actually quite a few non-traditionals in my program (Dal) both in terms of background and in terms of life-stage. I find my class is a really great mix of amazing people from age 21 to age 40 (yup... that's me).

 

Good luck to all you guys!

[Guest kayak22]

Hey there Mimicat65,

 

I was wondring what type of business you are running while in school. Reason for asking is that I own a business and am wanting to still run it - part time of course - if I get into school. It is wonderful to hear of another woman who has a family and works outside of school. I realize that it is not always easy, but I look for any advice you may have!

Thanks!

[Guest Mimicat65]

kayak22, I sent you a pm.

[Guest curiousam]

Hi there,

 

I was wondering if you have any advice or thoughts on taking the plunge and trying to get into med school (Dal) at age 32 and with a eight-month-old. Anything would help, just someone to talk to.

Thanks

Sam

[Guest Kirsteen]

Hi there,

 

As lone factors, age and status as a parent have little to do with odds of acceptance into medical school these days. It's probably more the associated factors, e.g., time, ability to partake in other activities or do well in school due to the time commitments involved with raising a family, that would present more of a hindrance to a successful application. Although I can't speak about Dalhousie, our school (UofC) has plenty of current medical students who are parents. (Some have become parents during their time in medical school as well.) So if medical school is what interests you, then your status as an older applicant with a family will, themselves, provide little hindrance to getting to where you would like to be.

 

Cheers,

Kirsteen

[Guest opiedog]

In regards to the family issue, two babies have been born to our class already (first year). One whose whose request for deferral was declined delivered her baby in Sept. The other is the father of a new baby. It hasn't been easy for them, but it's apparently do-able. It seems that our class at NOSM is a little out of the ordinary, many with established families, and definitely not the average age for med students. I believe our average age is 27 or so, but my own age pushes the stats up a fair bit. If you feel you can handle the workload, studying with students whose energy is most likely a bit higher than yours, and have the family backing you in your pursuit for your goals, definitely go for it.

 

My biggest fear in being an older applicant was not about being unable to handle the studies, but rather what would the impact of being out of work and huge tuition fees have on my pension (I was trying to think realistically). Would I be faring worse for going back to school and leaving my family in a financial crunch should something happen to me? Good sit-down chats with a professional financial planner helped to alleviate those fears and helped me to make the decision to attend.

 

It's a tough call, and you will have to wiegh a million different things that might be only relevent to you. I don't know anyone (yet) who has regretted going back to school though:)

[Guest cracked30]

The maternity/paternity leave thing. You do have to make up the time you take off. You can't leave for a year, miss that much clinical work and expect to be allowed to challenge your college exams.

 

Just an FYI

[Guest drcave]

Well, I did alriight on my MCAT again (PS 12, VR 13, BS 12, WS P), not bad after 10 years I guess 37-P vs 39-O.

 

I've started to fill out my UBC online application and I've realized that it's going to be tough to pick the right EC's to list on the 3 page max list to get the highest NAQ score. I'm definetly going to have to leave a bunch of stuff off - I guess thats the typical dilemma of non-trad applicants, we've done lots of cool things but there is not room for them all on our application. I know there are some activities that don't seem significant to me that might carry weight with the application committee. For example, I did a sweat lodge ceremony with a shaman from the Shuswap First Nation (involvement with the aboriginal community is one of the categories you are rated on). It was just one day to me and a cool experience no doubt, but it's just one day out of 12675 I've lived, and I have other longer, more meaningful experiences (to me). Is anyone else having the same problem, what to include what to leave out, knowing that in can make or break you.

[Guest wylie348]

Competitive is perhaps not an ideal way to look at it. Do you want it bad enough? I am over forty and just starting med school. I want it more than anything, and have worked my buns off to make it happen.

 

If you are willing to never give up then it will probably happen!

 

[Guest celeria]

i am having the same problem trying to figure out what to put down for the ubc appliation. i mean, what do you put for "experiences showing self reliance"? as mature applicants there are thousands of things that we could potentially put under this section... is running a household and paying your own way through university considered trivial?

[Guest nbmom]

congrats drcave thats a hot mcat score...can you channel some of that brilliance my way on august 19!

[Guest drcave]

Thanks, I hope you do well. I highly recommend taking the free MCAT at emcat.com and paying to do a few others as well. I got essentially the same marks as I did when I did the practice. These are actually old MCAT tests.

 

Check out the waitlist thread on the Calgary topic and you will see people who were waitlisted with similar scores, so I know I still have my work cut out for me to get in. Autobiographical essays are going to be a challenge (notice the "O" and "P") and interviews are going to be the real test for me. When someone asks a totally off the wall question I shudder to think what innappropriate responses might emerge from my mouth.

[Guest Lurkergonepublic]

Ha ha. You shoud put some of those crazy answers in this thread to get them out of your system. Just don't look for any pointers in the other answers.... (although most of the questions are common interview ones).

 

mock interview thread

[Guest Stalin]

age- 26

education- BSc Biology &

gpa. 3.6

education- LLB (law degree) and called to the bar..

mcat.. 8 10 12 Q

.. locked in a room.. doing due diligence..wanted to literally jump out the window and had an epiphany/awakening and decided to go to medical school.. applied all over ontario and alberta.. only got an interview at u of c.. and got in.

[Guest drcave]

Good for you. You are almost too young to be posting here

 

Now I am realizing a new problem - I have to play detective and track down all these different contacts, some from 15 years ago. That will probably decide which EC's make it on my list. I've never been one to keep in touch. Thank god for the Google.

[SkyeJ]

So someone who becomes a family doc at 28 has, say, 40 years to practice medicine till he or she is about 68 but someone at 43 will be at retirement 10 years later at 53 .

 

Money concerns are legitimate for non-trads (and trads as well), I know it is for me as someone hoping to start med school at 34. But I would hardly think of his decision as a waste of time and money. Some of us have worked for decades before med school and paid taxes and will borrow an arm and a leg now to become docs. Not everyone retires at 55.

 

Unless you plan to relocate to the North upon graduation, don't use that weak argument of underservice to discourage others. There aren't droves of 35/40 year olds taking the spots of deserving 22 year olds and the doctor shortage is of great complexity

 

 

I dont mean to be such a pest, but you are 36, assuming u apply next year @37, you will finish at 41....u will finish residency at 43..so u can pratice for 10 years and then about time to retire..

 

would u want to waste the money and time? if assuming u dont have the money to raise your family now, how will u get the money to go into med sch

 

also..in the view of society, especially canada that is in urgent need of doctors, dont waste a spot for others that can service for another 30-40 years.