# of years of undergrad allowed, please help!

[hnshhhm]

Hi all,

 

Long time (and boy do I mean long) lurker, post like once every six months or so. I am very familiar with the UWO admissions process, but I am in a rather unique situation.

 

I am entering (Sept '07) what should be my last year of of full-time studies. My gpa situation is like this:

 

'01-'02 GPA: 1.1 (suspended from program)

'02-'03 took year off, wasn't in school

'03-'04 GPA: 2.7

'04-'05 GPA: 2.2 (co-op student, only did one semester and took 3 courses)

'05-'06 GPA: 3.69 (full course load, enough senior level courses)

'06-'07 GPA: 3.68 (full course load, enough senior level courses)

 

So, after coming oh so close to the elusive 3.70 GPA the last two years, I'm in a bit of a bind. I was thinking to finish up next year ('07-'08) hopefully get a 3.70 and then apply since I only need one year to do so, and then do a victory lap.

 

However, how would it look if I opted NOT to do a victory lap, but instead do yet another year ('08-'09) as a part of my undergrad degree? The reason for doing so is that it would allow for more flexibility in terms of what courses I can take.

 

Also, by not doing a victory lap, years 07’-’08 and ’08-’09 could potentially be used for Queens, since they would not consider 1 year above their two year cutoff + the victory lap year like UWO does.

 

So what I'd like to know from those of you more experienced guys/gals (aneliz, TimmyMax, blinknoodle, Ploughboy, etc) is what are the consequences, if any, from completing an undergrad degree in 7 years? Does UWO care about such things? Have any of you come across people who got in under similar circumstances?

 

As always, thanks for you help.

 

 

 

P.S. - By the way, thanks again to you all for your insight in my last post (http://www.premed101.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20295) tuns out the guy was BS’ing about the letter and had a less than stellar reference letter from at least one person.

[webshy]

Also, by not doing a victory lap, years 07’-’08 and ’08-’09 could potentially be used for Queens, since they would not consider 1 year above their two year cutoff + the victory lap year like UWO does.

 

Queen's will consider your last two years of study in which you took at least 3.0 courses. Both years must be completed at the time of your application. It doesn't matter whether these two years are part of your degree or not. The two year cut-off, however, has been 0.1 above the overall cut-off for the past couple of years (3.78 rather than 3.68).

 

Elaine

[hnshhhm]

I didn't know that Elaine...thank you for telling me

 

edit: follow-up question: Do they care if it takes someone 7-8 years for one undergrad degree?

[jojo07]

i am in a similar situation as you are

[Jochi1543]

OP, have you taken the MCAT yet? Just curious, because if you scored below the cut-off for that, too, it might just be easier to take the Caribbean route. At this point, you'd have to do TWO more years of undergrad to qualify for Queen's and Western. That's 2 years of tuition and not earning any reasonable money. And then if you end up getting a 24 on your MCAT (or 42N....), you're ****ed completely. You just have to evaluate whether the small (and so far elusive) chance of getting into a Canadian school is worth it or whether you should just go the IMG route.

[jojo07]

but about caribean is that there is a competiton in residency and might cost someone more than doing it here

[Jochi1543]

but about caribean is that there is a competiton in residency and might cost someone more than doing it here

 

Yeah, but it might be realistically 10 years before the OP gets in for all we know. His/her only options are the "2 year" schools, and after trying for a while, s/he hasn't come any closer to being eligible for any of them, so it begs the question of whether it's all worth it. The relatively high cost of Caribbean schools is negated by the direct and indirect costs of attending undergrad for 8 years (the indirect costs involving years you've lost of receiving physician pay). So for every year spent trying to get the elusive 3.7, the OP is missing out on at least $100K a year in salary, paying $5000 in tuition, and quite possibly borrowing money for living expenses, as well. So in 2 years in Canada, s/he will have lost as much money as s/he would paying for med school in the Caribs for 4 years - but with NO guarantee of getting that 3.7 and getting in, while in the Caribs, s/he'd at least get that MD and stand a good chance of an FP/IM residency. And then if s/he does get into a Canadian school, there's still tuition for that. You need to do some cost/benefit analysis in such situations.

[jojo07]

carribean you should be ready to pay back 400k-500k after becoming an MD, so plus waiting for residence afterwards. the person might have an MD degree under his/her belt but then how long would have to wait for a spot due to the competition. He wont be able to practice in Canada. Both ways there is alot of burden

[hnshhhm]

Wow, nice to nice an old thread of mine creep back up to the top. For anyone else reading this, could someone answer my question:

 

Does Western care if it takes someone 7-8 years for one undergrad degree?

 

Anyway, as for Jochi and jojo:

 

jojo - keep your head up (seeing as how you are in the same situation as me). I won't quit until I get into a Candian school (I am 24 now, so I'll reconsider things once I hit 30). I suggest you do the same if you want it as badly.

 

Jochi - I've been a long time lurker as I've mentioned in my original post. Thanks for adding your 2 cents, I've read many of your posts, so its always nice to get feedback from one of the regulars

 

Now as for your question, I have a 33S (10PS, 13VR, 10BS), so I figure with an S and 13VR I am on the upper end of the spectrum as per UWO's requirements.

 

Money isn't an issue since I have enough for 4 years of med in Canada (i.e. 150K), so the cost/benefits analysis doesn't really apply. Besides, I'm not into medicine for $ anyway, so I'm not concerned about missed years that I could have been working as an MD. I just want in to a Canadian school, since I want to practice in canada - I don't want to take the IMG route.

 

The only negative I'll have going for me is that on my transcript (other than my terrible 1st marks) I would have completed an undergrad degree in 7 years. As I stated above (and the reason I made this thread), will UWO (or Queens/any other "2 year" school) frown upon this?

[Guest FockI'mOld!]

Hey y'all, I'm taking the long route as well, plan to do 6 years, and I'm not giving up because I'd like to specialize here in my home country. It's a great relief to see that I'm not the only person in this bind. Right now, there is nothing I'd like more than to show this forum that you can screw up 2/3 years in undergrad and still make it to med. Not that it's something to be proud of, but to show that patience and tenacity pays off.

 

As for whether Western cares if you take 7-8 years, my guess would be that if there was one spot left and you were tied in every respect to another applicant except he/she took 4 years, then the adcom would give preference to him/her. However, if you make the cutoff by a good margin, say 3.85 and your application is strong in all other respects, then I think you should be competitive. If anything, not giving up and sticking with it shows that you are serious and dedicated to becoming a physician.

[The Law]

Based on previous posters' comments (some who were on the adcom), Western is 25% MCAT, 25% GPA for top year and then 50% interview. It doesn't matter how you get your degree as long as you have two years above the GPA. This all being said, it's not easy to get the score necessary to make the mcat cutoffs at Western and Queen's. You are in a tough bind, and realistically the only options you have are either:

 

1) Write the MCAT, make the cutoffs, get 3.7+ in a full course load this year and then ROCK YOUR interview next year

(accomplishing all of this is tough!)

 

2) Apply overseas, your marks are low for the United States, so I wouldn't apply there unless you had a really good MCAT score... The carib is the other option.

 

 

It's tough, but if you are willing to put the time into it - go for it. =)

[Jochi1543]

Based on previous posters' comments (some who were on the adcom), Western is 25% MCAT, 25% GPA for top year and then 50% interview. It doesn't matter how you get your degree as long as you have two years above the GPA. This all being said, it's not easy to get the score necessary to make the mcat cutoffs at Western and Queen's. You are in a tough bind, and realistically the only options you have are either:

 

1) Write the MCAT, make the cutoffs, get 3.7+ in a full course load this year and then ROCK YOUR interview next year

(accomplishing all of this is tough!)

 

2) Apply overseas, your marks are low for the United States, so I wouldn't apply there unless you had a really good MCAT score... The carib is the other option.

 

 

It's tough, but if you are willing to put the time into it - go for it. =)

 

Hey dimwit, read his post...he had a 33S with all the cutoffs hit, so he doesn't have to worry about meeting the cutoffs. I agree that if you've already hit all the cutoffs for the MCAT, it's worth it to try for Canadian schools.

[ploughboy]

Hey y'all' date=' I'm taking the long route as well, plan to do 6 years, and I'm not giving up because I'd like to specialize here in my home country. It's a great relief to see that I'm not the only person in this bind. Right now, there is nothing I'd like more than to show this forum that you can screw up 2/3 years in undergrad and still make it to med. Not that it's something to be proud of, but to show that patience and tenacity pays off.

 

As for whether Western cares if you take 7-8 years, my guess would be that if there was one spot left and you were tied in every respect to another applicant except he/she took 4 years, then the adcom would give preference to him/her. However, if you make the cutoff by a good margin, say 3.85 and your application is strong in all other respects, then I think you should be competitive. If anything, not giving up and sticking with it shows that you are serious and dedicated to becoming a physician.[/quote']

 

You need two (2) full-time years above the cut-off in a degree which will allow you to pursue graduate studies (honours degree or equivalent). I believe there are also requirements wrt senior-level courses in one of the year.

 

Western doesn't care if you have 10 undergraduate degrees, or if it took you 10 years to get one undergrad degree.

 

Good luck!

[hnshhhm]

 

Western doesn't care if you have 10 undergraduate degrees, or if it took you 10 years to get one undergrad degree.

 

Good luck!

 

Thanks for the info! Always nice to hear it from one of the people that I orignally sought out to seek the truth from. Kinda cool to see there are a few others in similar situations as me. Here's to the 7-year degree plan!

[jojo07]

I think our situation prevents us to apply to schools that look at all the undergrad years. I was wondering are there schools in the U.S that looks at your two best undegrad years like western and queens?

[Jochi1543]

I think our situation prevents us to apply to schools that look at all the undergrad years. I was wondering are there schools in the U.S that looks at your two best undegrad years like western and queens?

 

No. An upward trend is nice, but you still need to have a decent cumulative to be competitive (3.5 or above...3.7+ is better).

[jojo07]

so in the states they look at cumulative gpa....3.5 is impossible for the OP and me due to the circumstances.