I do not want to be a doctor anymore

[noncestvrai]

My point was not on the ability to actually carry out the desired plan, but merely to take the decision to go forth, without needing moral approval from peers.

 

If I want to quit medicine after 10 years of practice and live off the interest of my earnings, while traveling the world, without anything holding me back (except maybe a wife and kids or whatever the situation...), I certainly won't be hampered by the "moral judgement" from my peers on my decision.

 

noncestvrai

[youngdad]

This has to be the most fascinating thread. ffp I enjoyed reading your long post. I like to hear reality.

I think for most people even if they do get the career of their dreams a great deal of it is just work. It is those moments in between that have meaning that remind them they are living their dream.

Outside interests are important.

I am an applicant and I want to be an ERP (for now). I just want to save some peoples lives. I think it would be cool. I know that there is a ton of other stuff that comes with being a doctor. Some good, some lame. I think that as long as I get to save some peoples lives on the way and I have enough money for my own family, I will be able to get through the stuff that gives me a real mind rash. It's a bit of a trick but I actually find joy in the mundane.

[xylem29]

My point was not on the ability to actually carry out the desired plan, but merely to take the decision to go forth, without needing moral approval from peers.

 

If I want to quit medicine after 10 years of practice and live off the interest of my earnings, while traveling the world, without anything holding me back (except maybe a wife and kids or whatever the situation...), I certainly won't be hampered by the "moral judgement" from my peers on my decision.

 

noncestvrai

 

Don't underestimate the peer pressure power of premed101ers!!

[KennethToronto]

thanks for the great post ffp. I enjoyed reading it.

[noncestvrai]

Life is cruel. No doubt about that.

 

Was she pretty at least?

 

noncestvrai

[Zuckman]

I hope she was able to follow her dreams eventually. It sounds a bit sad if she gave up on becoming a doctor.

[A-Stark]

I guess. She has a stereotypical premed personality that makes me less sad if she gave up.

[medaholic]

To be realistic, you have to realize that medicine, or at least being a doctor is a job. Some of you will say otherwise, that it is a calling where one has to devote their lives. That can be true for some people too. Each person can has their own perspective on what medicine means. But Medicine is just like any other field. Art, Engineering, Teaching, whatever you have an interest in.

 

There are artists that see their work as a calling. Engineers who find intellectual stimulation from the real world problems they solve everyday. Teaching can be a very meaningful job, educating and helping our future generation.

 

Medicine is not immune from these real world factors. There are bills to pay, limited resources to go around, bureaucracy, politics, constant education.

 

I think that once you stop having this grandeur view of medicine and that it will be provide you with immense satisfaction and be your dream job, then you can seriously consider and see if it's something for you. Don't only focus on the good things, but also look at the bad. And after that, you will be happier with your choice if you can accept them all.

 

There's nothing wrong with leaving medicine, just like there's nothing wrong with someone choosing to pursue medicine. To each their own. We all have different values. Worry about yourself and do what aligns with your own values.

[Dr.Cave]

I totally agree. But lots of premeds like to view themselves as saints and can't let go of the myth that is has to be a calling. If they can;t do this then they can't look inside themselves and understand what truly motivates them. Me, I'm a realist. I have many characteristics that will make me a good doctor but I also have many flaws that I have to be aware of in order to avoid problems e.g. my sense of humour runs a little on the raw side and I like joke around too much. plus I'm a total dog ****er who will have to be sure to do all the patient records right away and resist the temptation to just do them later like some family docs do. Anyway I'm not going into medicine because it is a calling, I'm doing it because I know its something I will enjoy, something I'll be good at, something I will find satisfying, something I can earn a decent living at, and something that is portable. If the op or any other doc/medstudent understands themselves well enough to realize that they need to change careers then that is the best thing to do. For me, I'd have to be really freakin sure that I could not be happy as a doc and that would probably take working for a few years as one.

[Mei_Mei_girl]

I'm not a doctor or in med school, but speaking to doctors who have practised for a long time,

it strikes me that they give similar advice:

 

Its not all fun and games. So...something really has to pull a doctor's socks up to work hard at it and not slide in the long run.

 

too many "disillusioned" premeds dreaming of granduer, like getting into med school is the automatic road to heaven

[Zuckman]

Ya, those premeds start to annoy me sometimes. I've worked with lots of specialists and all those I've talked to see it as just like any other job. They have lost their views of grandeur and come to reality.

 

One thing I really can't stand about the medical field is the huge number of type A's!! I really want to find a specialty that has less of these people!

[Guest soaring_eagle]

My friend from undergrad... she's The elevators where I work are perpetually out-of-service. The other day, I was watching one of the elevator repairmen and thinking about this thread. Nobody would fault him for hating or being dispassionate about his job... yet if he messes something up, a whole carload of people could go plummeting to their deaths. How come, when a doctor mentions being unhappy or dissatisfied, (s)he is faced with a barrage of "OMG, you don't care about people, your patients are all gonna die, people like you don't belong in medicine!!!!!"

 

Because there comes a point where the high dollars paid to physicians (by taxpayers) in considered in light of the salary the evelvator repairman makes.

 

There are many applicants applying to medicine. Consider that some of them will perform "minimally as much as they have to" down the road, and some of them will do more . Taxpayers deserve the best physicians.

 

"Care" is in my opinion a useless word. One can care all they want but still do nothing. If a physician is treating their immediate family versus some random taxpayer, who will get the better performance.

 

It takes effort to translate into service.

[A-Stark]

Well, physicians shouldn't be involved in treating their immediate families. In fact, I'm certain that provincial colleges have policies against that very thing.

[Wolvenstar]

Because there comes a point where the high dollars paid to physicians (by taxpayers) in considered in light of the salary the evelvator repairman makes.

 

There are many applicants applying to medicine. Consider that some of them will perform "minimally as much as they have to" down the road, and some of them will do more . Taxpayers deserve the best physicians.

 

"Care" is in my opinion a useless word. One can care all they want but still do nothing. If a physician is treating their immediate family versus some random taxpayer, who will get the better performance.

 

It takes effort to translate into service.

 

 

 

Actually you could almost expect the random taxpayer to get a better performance, as a doctor can look at the case objectively, whereas is a doctor was somehow allowed to treat his wife, who was dying, one could see how the doctor would be freaking out and rather useless.

[Guest soaring_eagle]

Thank you very much,

But I was speaking metaphorically.

 

We work harder when we have something to gain, don't we as people?

 

And theoretically we do more for our families than immediate strangers, right?

 

I am implying that just because a doctor is a "doctor" they may offer service to different people in different ways, or in a larger sense, have no motivation for the extra push.

 

I don't want to fight with anybody. Think as you choose. I've seen too many "doctors" out there who groan through their days and probably just stay in it for the $.

[Guest soaring_eagle]

its like the proff whose a SOB after he gets tenure.

 

oh, i could imagine he was so sweet and hardworking before that.

[Zuckman]

Hey ffp,

 

Great post! In your opinion, which specialties have less type A's? This is a very big deal for me and will be a huge factor in my decision of a specialty. I want to really like my colleagues. I can already tell that I won't like surgery because of what I've heard about the people in that type of specialty.

 

Zuck

[medaholic]

Due to the nature of medicine, and the aspect of saving and improving lives, it often creates an unrealistic and inflated expectation for patients. Patients want their doctors to be altruistic, experienced, have good bed-side manners, be hardworking, see them in a timely manner, have a good attitude, be well-rested, etc etc.

 

At the end of the day, it's unreasonable to expect all of these things from your doctor constantly. Doctors are humans too, and everyone will have a bad day once in a while, even the people who absolutely love their work! Factor in sleepless nights, long work hours and being responsible for the sickest people - that can die not from your fault, but from their progression of sicknesses- and then the risk of being sued over it, doctors face many daily challenges. Granted, being a doctor also comes with its own rewards and satisfaction.

 

One situation I have been thinking about lately is given the choice between a well-mannered good attitude doctor and a highly trained doctor, which would you choose? For instance, you are sick and you require immediate care. Would you choose the resident who has a positive outlook on life and takes extra time with their patients OR would you choose the jaded older doctor who happens to be the most competent doctor in the hospital?

 

Patients can accuse one of having terrible bed side manners, while others will demand that they be treated by only the best. Ideally, you would want the best of both doctors, but in real life there are limited resources to go around.

 

And this goes with any other profession out there. You are the coach of a baseball team. It is the bottom of the ninth inning, two outs, there are two bases loaded, your team is trailing by two points and you have a choice. Do you choose the new guy who has shown dedication all season, showed up and stayed late for all the practices and who has put in the extra effort to be a good team player. OR do you choose your best hitter who has done well under pressure before but happens to have a terrible attitude and does not care about teamwork. (I know you can't really compare baseball and medicine, but I hope this analogy makes sense)

[medaholic]

Hey ffp,

 

Great post! In your opinion, which specialties have less type A's? This is a very big deal for me and will be a huge factor in my decision of a specialty. I want to really like my colleagues. I can already tell that I won't like surgery because of what I've heard about the people in that type of specialty.

 

Zuck

 

Certain specialties will attract certain types of people, but you'll find that in all specialties there will be all of the different types of people. Don't let this perceived notion that only "type A" (whatever you mean by that) do surgery. You might end up liking surgery. There are surgeons that are laid back and composed and there are surgeons who throw tantrums and instruments when things go wrong.

 

It's not so much a Type A (highly competitive, impatient, large drive) or Type B personality (patient, relaxed, easy going) that matters, but other factors such as dedication, diligence, integrity, compassion, etc etc. These traits apply to both A and B, and you will find them in almost all doctors.

[A-Stark]

Don't write it off that quickly! Do a surgery elective early on and see how you find it - clerkship will give you a good idea anyway.

[leviathan]

One situation I have been thinking about lately is given the choice between a well-mannered good attitude doctor and a highly trained doctor, which would you choose?

You have to remember that the doctor who is empathetic and caring might be more diligent with your care than the other lazy doctor who cares less about what happens to you, and only does enough to remove legal liability. There's a tradeoff in that sense as well.

[D-Rock]

^^

 

True enough. I also think it depends on the patient's personality and the circumstances. I know of a situation where a patient's work dictated a desire to have the highly skilled technician (with a god-complex) do the procedure and be out on day surgery versus the patient who had a very long recovery (months) in the hospital with regular contact with the surgeon and thus preferred the personable, willing to take time with the patient type.

[Wolvenstar]

You have to remember that the doctor who is empathetic and caring might be more diligent with your care than the other lazy doctor who cares less about what happens to you, and only does enough to remove legal liability. There's a tradeoff in that sense as well.

 

Don't mistake a doctor who is highly trained but has poor bedside manners as one who is lazy. I have seen many highly trained people who are not so good at socializing but are keen observers and are passionate, not lazy about what they do....they well...just don't know how to be polite, but for me when it comes down to it saving my life or getting me better is more important so if I can get the doctor who is the best, but acts like an ass than do it. If he is the best at what he does, then maybe he deserves to act how he will (or she).

 

ffp, i can understand your belief that doctors can become jaded through the conditions they work in. My point through this has been that students who go through medicine "just because" or for other reasons similar to that are already shooting themselves in the foot. In my view people who enter med school should be wanting to be in medicine. I mean if someone is not motivated to become a doctor, but enters medicine for other reasons (family pressure is a good example), then how will they be motivated to do their job. The job of a doctor is not only to have excellent bedside manners, but mainly to heal people. While bedside manners can be an essential key to that, doctors who talk and act like an ass can still excell at what they do.

[Guest soaring_eagle]

ffp, i can understand your belief that doctors can become jaded through the conditions they work in. My point through this has been that students who go through medicine "just because" or for other reasons similar to that are already shooting themselves in the foot. In my view people who enter med school should be wanting to be in medicine. I mean if someone is not motivated to become a doctor, but enters medicine for other reasons (family pressure is a good example), then how will they be motivated to do their job. The job of a doctor is not only to have excellent bedside manners, but mainly to heal people. While bedside manners can be an essential key to that, doctors who talk and act like an ass can still excell at what they do.

 

amen. my point

 

we need EFFECTIVE service, not phony service.

probably has something to do with those DELIVERING the service

[Wolvenstar]

I should also add that (just in case someone assumes the opposite about me) I don't believe that doctors should be workaholics by necesssity. There is no surprise that there are alot of older doctors who are jaded, as it was the mentality back in the day to work from 8 till midnight. However this social norm is changing and I believe for the better.

 

Doctors might be spending more time with their family but this does not mean that they are less useful or passionate about their career. When I talk about how a doctor who when they were a student went to medschool because they wanted to practice medicine will perform better than someone who went to medschool and became a doctor just because, I am not meaning that the ones who have a passion for medicine will be workaholics. What I am saying is that the quality of work they deliver will be better than someone who is doing medicine for reasons other than loving the job.

 

People who don't love medicine don't excell at it, same with any trade/school subject/etc. Whether their passion and love for medicine translates into an incredibly caring doctor or one who is a medical genius both are passionate about what they do.

 

Also you can't decide whether a person went into medicine for which reasons when they are middle-aged and burnt out. Look at them when they are still in their 20s,30s, and early 40s. I honestly believe that you will see the ones who love medicine and/or helping people, still satisfied with their jobs and generally happy with life. Whereas this would be the time that others who are realizing medicine is just a job for them not a career are starting to get burnt out.