Canadian MD stars in U.S. ads touting private health care

[AdamP]

I remember seeing this ad on CNN, and didn't catch the group pushing it.

 

Then I saw this article in my saturday star.

 

http://www.thestar.com/article/631703

 

An old and on going debate, I'm sure we'll hear more about the comparisons between our two systems as the health care reform debates start to heat up in the US. What are peoples' thoughts?

[Tango Charlie]

His criticisms are hardly unjustified. There are a lot of better healthcare systems than ours, and although the US certainly isn't one of them, it's understandable that proponents of privitized healthcare in the States would point northward as an example of how socialized medicine can be executed poorly and be a burden for everyone.

 

Also, I don't think it's wrong that Dr. Day did that interview, as I have a feeling this thread might go that way too. He has no obligation to defend our healthcare system, and in fact a little embarassment might do us some good. I just hope it doesn't keep the US from undergoing the reforms it needs any longer than they already have.

[medisforme]

Dr. Day makes an absolute killing at his cambie street clinic so his views are hardly surprising:eek: . He operates one of the few private surgical clinics in the province.

 

Here is another article from the NEJM to give some more information on Dr. Day and this subject.

 

http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/354/16/1661

http://www.brianday.ca/new-england-journal-interview.html

[tennisball80]

There is some $$$ involved inside for sure.

[n00b]

would a private clinic work in other provinces? do patients buy insurance or just pay out of pocket?

[A-Stark]

As if I needed another reason to dislike Brian Day...

 

His criticisms are hardly unjustified. There are a lot of better healthcare systems than ours, and although the US certainly isn't one of them, it's understandable that proponents of privitized healthcare in the States would point northward as an example of how socialized medicine can be executed poorly and be a burden for everyone.

 

Except we don't have socialized health care, and the likes of Dr. Day are asking simply to be able to simultaneously charge government insurance and extra-bill patients.

 

Also, I don't think it's wrong that Dr. Day did that interview, as I have a feeling this thread might go that way too. He has no obligation to defend our healthcare system, and in fact a little embarassment might do us some good. I just hope it doesn't keep the US from undergoing the reforms it needs any longer than they already have.

 

I don't think he has an obligation to do anything. That makes him no less of a profiteer and any of his opinions must be seen in the light of the conflict of interest inherent in playing up reforms which help his own bottom line.

[Alastriss]

It is comparing apples vs oranges. Each system can be criticized not by intercomparisom but my comparison of what it is and what it could be while upholding the values it attempted to hold.

 

Here, we decided that social solidarity and equity preceeds efficiency. It is clearly stated in one of the canadian values a la Commissioner Romanow. So we have market exclusion as waiting lists.

 

Over there, they decided to sacrifice social solidarity (at least for those who are not poor, old, and veterans - medicaid, medicaire, and VA) for the sake of allocative efficiency. We have market exclusion not by waiting lists but by price.

 

I guess it is akin to Baskin Robins' 31 cent day ice cream. Some of us love thehe fact that its affordable, and others hated that they can't use their money to pay and wait less.

 

There really isn't "right" or "wrong" because it ultimatey depends on what you want in a system. There is only "good" and better only within the context of the values you have set.

 

 

We get a lot of heat for our heathcare system about how it is not "good", but we may have a lot of efficiencies but achieving the economic optima does not mean achieving the social optima, which is often something not really taken into account by critics.

[A-Stark]

I disagree that we've sacrificed efficiency - indeed, single-payer insurance (~50%) is vastly cheaper than the patchwork of different insurers and systems in the US. However, referral networks are highly variable in terms of speed and organization, and the human resources side of things tends to be undersupplied.

[Tango Charlie]

As if I needed another reason to dislike Brian Day...

 

I wasn't familiar with him before, but having read your post, I've done some reading on him, and I can see where your opinion comes from.

 

That said, I don't want what I wrote to come across as defending him as a physician. But in the context of the video I don't think what he said was inaccurate. However, the reforms he says our health care system needs probably aren't the ones he has in mind.

 

But, nevertheless, I do agree that we're not a model of good health care that other countries would want to emulate, and I do think our system needs reforms.

[Alastriss]

I disagree that we've sacrificed efficiency - indeed, single-payer insurance (~50%) is vastly cheaper than the patchwork of different insurers and systems in the US. However, referral networks are highly variable in terms of speed and organization, and the human resources side of things tends to be undersupplied.

 

 

No we definitely have (in the economic sense). Anything that prevents individuals from making their marginal benefit = marginal cost is less than ideal, but I think we are talking about different types of "efficiency".

 

Single-payer insurance is cheaper administratively but doesn't make any attempts to alleviate adverse selection, so it may not necessarily be better.

[n00b]

one of the biggest problems with canadian health care is the moral hazard. anything that is free opens up a can of worms.

[AdamP]

^bump^

 

These CPAC commericals are getting more frequent, and more damming of the Canadian system, anyone else catching them.

 

http://www.facesofgovernmenthealthcare.com/

 

http://cprights.org/

 

let the propaganda wars begin.

[tooty]

one word:

 

[Wolvenstar]

While I don't want to drag up an old thread, I remember being new to the site and participating in a debate about our health care system. Frankly I don't believe our system can be public or private but rather the ugly hodgepodge baby (you can tell i am not wanting to enter the health care industry because of the system itself, lol). I still support the idea of the two-tier system. While many people will look at the states and say that any sort of private doesn't work, I personally look at Europe and there are countries with better health care systems than our own that follow this system.