skvangs Posted June 18, 2009 Report Share Posted June 18, 2009 Hi, I am getting 2 German Shepherd puppies imported from Europe. I am in undergrad still, however. I have heard that having dogs in medical school is tough but possible and rewarding. How about during residency? Is this at all possible, being single and having 2 dogs? If everything goes well, my parents would live close by to help out. Any experiences? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satsuma Posted June 19, 2009 Report Share Posted June 19, 2009 If you are living by yourself, having dogs will be difficult once you hit clerkship and throughout residency (and your career, depending on what you choose). You will have an irregular schedule and be spending 24-30 hours at the hospital without coming home...roughly every 4 days depending on the rotation you are on. Gonna be hard to let your dogs out to do their business if you aren`t there. Not to mention, they will just miss you...and depending on your dog, that can create a whole set of problems. And also, when you come home post call, you will want to sleep, not go for a walk with your dogs. Dogs are great. But if you envision a life where you won`t be seeing them, could be better to hold off until you are at a stage in your life where you can enjoy them and they can actually have you around. If you do really want to get dogs while a med student/resident - Then you could pay for a dog walking service where they would come a couple times a day to walk and spend time with your dogs, or pay even more for doggie daycare (though that doesn`t help for call days cause I dont`think you can leave them there overnight). Or if you have really nice parents, and they agree to be mostly responsible for your dogs...then there you go, you are set. But it sounds like you have already committed to getting these puppies. So if there is no turning back, it will be your responsibility to ensure they are cared for when you aren`t around...however, you decide to do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renin Posted June 19, 2009 Report Share Posted June 19, 2009 I decided to hold off on getting any pets until I have time for them, so I have an avatar puppy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CutieYellow Posted June 20, 2009 Report Share Posted June 20, 2009 My husband and I are both residents - or rather, i'm finishing up residency in a week... and we recently got a puppy. I must say, it's a LOT of work. And everyone else is right, sometimes, you have calls q4 days, and it's difficult, and you feel bad that the pup is alone...and obviously, if it needs to do its business, it's gonna be hard... so ya, parents around are GOOD! We got a small mini pinscher, so she mostly goes on pee pads and doesn't need to go outside, which is perfect, so if we don't make it home on a regular schedule, she doesn't have any bladder retention problems. I do feel bad tho, leaving her alone most of the day... I'm glad we got her now though, as i'm done residency and my schedule will become somewhat more regular, to spend more time with her. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crackers Posted July 6, 2009 Report Share Posted July 6, 2009 My wife and I were both residents, and we got a dog 4 months before I wrote my Royal College exams. Between call and study groups it's lucky we didn't drive the poor thing nuts. Having someone who thinks you're the greatest being in the world, because you can open the food container, gives you a nice balance against medicine, when you think about it. Advice: crate training is a must unless someone will always be home, lots of walks are therapeutic for both of you, and try to keep to a routine as much as you can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Hicks Posted July 6, 2009 Report Share Posted July 6, 2009 Hi there, I basically agree with the above posts re figuring out how to care for the dog ie walking the dog, potty breaks, etc etc, but I'd also like to add that owning an imported GSD isn't like owning just any other dog. If by imported GSD you mean a workingline GSD (ie Tiekerhook, pohranicni straze, or even some showlines that have Schutzhund titles), then you really better be prepared for what you're getting yourself into. I really hope you do have experience working with these types of dogs, but when I read your post, it sounds to me that you do not. I say this because because people familiar with workingline working breeds such as GSDs, malinois, dutch shepherds, etc, will already have an idea of the amount of work involved in raising them, and will therefore be able to guage whether they will have that time available during such commitments as med school/law school/residency/etc. I mean no disrespect by these comments, but I am a dog advocate before a person advocate, and I too often see excellent working dogs turfed to the pound because the owners claim the dog is an ADD hyper nutcase (Incidentally, the club where I train my dogs in search and rescue exclusively uses dutch shepherds adopted from animal shelters just because these 'ADD hyper nutcase' dogs are in fact excellent, high drive dogs with incredible work ethic - they are not pet quality because of their high drives but are excellent for law enforcement, SAR, etc). I also don't see why you would want TWO GSDs - getting two pups at once is not a good thing to do, esp not with GSDs. Here's my personal experience with my latest german import. I'm sharing this because this is the reality of what you may end up with when you buy workingline GSDs: My guy is a 17 month old german shepherd dog, which I got as a 9wk pup in the last year of my MSc. I'm also starting meds at UofT this fall. My pup's pedigree includes dogs involved with narcotics/SAR/border patrol/schutzhund. By import standards, if you put him on a scale ranging from couch potatoe to gangster-badass-working dog, he is somewhere near the middle, more to the gangster-badass than to the couch potatoe (say 6.5 out of 10). Yet my pup is still a very dominant male all around. He has substantial prey and food drive. He is very sharp (ie he has a low threshold for stimulation, whether excitement or aggression), is territorially dominant, does not like strangers (incl. neighbours, children, friends, relatives), does not like to be petted (except by me), is only bonded to me, is very possessive of me, and is extremely defensive of me. Sounds cool, right? I don't think so. I have had to put an enormous amount of effort into establishing my dominance over him, and laying down his obedience foundation. We're not talking clicker training or treat training. If you're not familiar with the work of Konrad Most or Bill Koehler, then you're not ready for a workingline GSD. You have to keep in mind that Workingline GSDs are bred to be 'manstoppers' ie not afraid to go after humans. They can be a liability if not properly trained. Most dogs are not afraid to bark and chase people, but few will engage a human and lay down a full-mouth bite. Workingline GSDs are bred for 'full mouth' bites. They're bred to nail people, hard. It took a lot of work (major understatement), but now my dog is reliable off-leash in any situation. He rides buses with me, we can walk around busy malls, hospitals, schools, etc. We can go inside stores, and people can pet him if I introduce them properly, but these are all things I've had to train him to do. People with retrievers and other happy-go-lucky dogs are less likely to have to train their dog to accept being petted. Their dogs are more predisposed to be friendly, submissive, gentle. Meanwhile, I've had to train my dog to be these things. Training him probably extended my MSc program by 6 months. But I knew what I was getting into. And, the beauty is that I now have the most wonderful companion I could have ever asked for. Truly my best friend, through and through. I spend more time with him than I do with any of my friends, or even my girlfriend. But I had to put the effort in to earn his respect and trust. You really gotta love dogs, and working dogs, and solving behaviour problems, if you want to get a workingline GSD. I don't worry about him now that med school will start because he's fully trained, calm at home, has his own large fenced enclosure, and can stay at my training club's facility, which is a sprawling ranch, during long days. On the other hand, you may get lucky and your pups may be subdued, sweet, with low drives, low civil aggression, etc, in which case things will be somewhat less difficult (in relative terms - we're talking working shepherds, here). But don't expect it. Prepare for the worst. Bottom line, you better really have a passion for working dogs, and you better go into this purchase thinking that your dog will be an aggressive, noisy, destructive, unmanageable dog, because if you're not committed to training him and building a bond with him, then that's what he will become. And it's not his fault. I also apologize if I sound harsh or abrasive, but again, I'm an advocate for the dog, not the person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura_333 Posted July 6, 2009 Report Share Posted July 6, 2009 Hello, I'm assuming that importing dogs is very expensive, and possibly in your case a lot of work as the poster above pointed out. Perhaps you should consider adopting an animal, the website http://www.adoptapet.com is great for finding pets locally. In general, I wish people would not support breeding dogs when there are so many homeless dogs in shelters. The second I have my own house I'm going to adopt a dog such as the one below on the site: "Sierra's story... Sierra is a 3 yr old Rhodesian Ridgeback cross (possibly mastiff or great dane) who has had a terribly deprived life. Her family lost their home over a year ago and moved into a RV on a relatives property. Sierra however was moved into a small shed on the property. The family would walk Sierra occasionally but when Sierra finally bit her owners hand when he tried to force her back in the shed, they stopped walking her altogether. Sierra spent the next year in the shed, never once getting outside. When we went to pick up Sierra and brought her out of the shed for the first time in a year, her eyes literally bugged out of her head. Her reaction to being out in the world was one of pure joy. Sierra did not bite any of us and has never bitten the trainer who is now working with her." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fireball Posted July 6, 2009 Report Share Posted July 6, 2009 I already own two dogs (chihuahua's) who are my fur children that I would never part with, so I will just have to learn to work around it when it comes to my residency. I got a single room basement apartment as I thought it would be too difficult to find a roommate that is okay with dogs, and that I could also trust. I figure that I might be able to find someone for my second year that likes having dogs around, after I meet all my classmates. Hopefully for my residency I'll have a roommate and we'll have schedules that will limit the long hours the dogs spend alone but at least they have eachother and they can be trained to go on pee pads as well. If not...there are always dog sitters out there who charge $15/hr to come and visit/walk/feed your dog. I hate when people ask me if I am bringing my dogs with me when I move...I always reply, "would you leave your kids behind?". I guess I am bitter after having volunteered at the local pound for 5 years and seeing all the abandoned dogs. The worst part is that the majority of dogs that are left at the pound are from students who bought them and after realizing the level of committment required or after they got into their careers, they just leave them behind, like they're a piece of furniture. As for not having a dog and getting it at this point all I can say is they are a lot of work to raise. If you don't take the time to train them properly, they will be triple the work later on. I rescued both of my dogs so they had tons of behavioural issues when I got them, and it took a lot time, patience and perseverance (that us pre-medders know a lot about ) but they are totally worth it. I love coming home from a long day at school to see them, as they make me smile no matter what. They are always happy to see me, and they love me unconditionally. They are the best study buddies too! They just curl up beside me and sleep while I study for 6 hrs at a time, and they are perfectly happy to go for a walk whenever I need a break. I think every potential dog owner should read this: 10 Commandments for Dogs -- 1. My life is likely to last 10-15 years. Any separation from you will be painful for me. Remember that BEFORE you get me. 2. Give me time to understand what you want from me. 3. Place your trust in me, it is crucial to my well being. 4. Don't be angry with me for long, and don't lock me up as punishment. You have your work, entertainment and friends. I have only YOU. 5. Talk to me sometimes. Even if I don't understand your words, I understand your voice. 6. Be aware that however you treat me, I'll never forget. 7. Please don't hit me. I can't hit back, but I can bite and scratch and I really don't want to do that. 8. Before you scold me for being uncooperative, obstinate, or lazy, ask yourself if something might be bothering me. Perhaps I'm not getting the right foods or I've been out in the sun too long or my heart is getting old and weak! 9. Take care of me when I get old. You will get old too. 10. Go with me on difficult journeys. NEVER say, "I can't bear to watch, or let it happen in my absence." Everything is easier for me if your are there. And always remember, I LOVE YOU! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fireball Posted July 6, 2009 Report Share Posted July 6, 2009 P.S - If you can't already tell...I am a huge proponent of adopting dogs! If you are unsure about getting a dog you can also foster a dog for a while to see if you're up to it. Adoption agencies are also in dire need of foster families, and then you can see if the dog is a good fit for your family or your life! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jochi1543 Posted July 7, 2009 Report Share Posted July 7, 2009 . I hate when people ask me if I am bringing my dogs with me when I move...I always reply, "would you leave your kids behind?". OMG, QFT. I hate being asked whether I'm taking my cats with me. Pets are not disposable, people! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halcyon Posted July 8, 2009 Report Share Posted July 8, 2009 P.S - If you can't already tell...I am a huge proponent of adopting dogs! If you are unsure about getting a dog you can also foster a dog for a while to see if you're up to it. Adoption agencies are also in dire need of foster families, and then you can see if the dog is a good fit for your family or your life! Fireball, You are adorable and ultra-sweet! The dogs of the world must love you very much Haly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
momo Posted July 9, 2009 Report Share Posted July 9, 2009 P.S - If you can't already tell...I am a huge proponent of adopting dogs! If you are unsure about getting a dog you can also foster a dog for a while to see if you're up to it. Adoption agencies are also in dire need of foster families, and then you can see if the dog is a good fit for your family or your life! thanks for your post fireball- I also own two chihuahuas, and I get the same questions all the time - will you give them away if you have to? My answer is always no. If you commit to caring for living, breathing, feeling beings then it's like having children - you don't leave them, you don't abuse them, you take responsibility. I HATE people who just leave animals behind...hate them. In med school, even first year, I don't have as much time to spend with my boys, but I check in on them as often as I can, or my friends do, or i take them to a reputable daycare in the city for playtime! As everyone else said, it IS possible, but it is NOT a game, these are lives, and you need to be very sure that you are willing to give up certain things or not be able to live in certain places, or have to rush home when you'd rather have a nap at the hospital. Just be responsible and it will work! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skvangs Posted August 11, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2009 OMG, guys...chill. I just came back from a long vacation in Europe (where I picked up my pups). They are fantastic! Bill Hicks, I must say that I am extremely impressed with your GSD knowledge. I got my dogs from Jinopo, so I have the Pohranicni Straze line. My parents have owned DDR dogs since Iwas a baby. Our last one died 4 years ago, and I decided to get my parents 2 new ones (their idea, now that there 2 kids are out of the house). These guys have HUGE prey drive and are very mouthy. Starting to show signs of suspicion. In RE: exercise, our last dog would go for a 20 min walk in the morning, go for 4 miles on the treadmill 1hr after lunch, 10 mins fetch and a 20 min walk in the evening. I don't know why 2 GSDs won't be good, they are littermates andthe breeder has many such owners with 2 littermates living in the same household. Socialization even for working dogs is good so that they can recognize a threat from a non threat and will learn discrimination. Thanks for the info, you weren't being abrasive. I sent you a PM. In RE: to adopting. I am so with you guys when it comes to adopting from a shelter. i just don't want to deal with the attendant behavioural/health problems that unfortunately may come along with one of those poor dogs. Call me lazy or w/e. Hi there, I basically agree with the above posts re figuring out how to care for the dog ie walking the dog, potty breaks, etc etc, but I'd also like to add that owning an imported GSD isn't like owning just any other dog. If by imported GSD you mean a workingline GSD (ie Tiekerhook, pohranicni straze, or even some showlines that have Schutzhund titles), then you really better be prepared for what you're getting yourself into. I really hope you do have experience working with these types of dogs, but when I read your post, it sounds to me that you do not. I say this because because people familiar with workingline working breeds such as GSDs, malinois, dutch shepherds, etc, will already have an idea of the amount of work involved in raising them, and will therefore be able to guage whether they will have that time available during such commitments as med school/law school/residency/etc. I mean no disrespect by these comments, but I am a dog advocate before a person advocate, and I too often see excellent working dogs turfed to the pound because the owners claim the dog is an ADD hyper nutcase (Incidentally, the club where I train my dogs in search and rescue exclusively uses dutch shepherds adopted from animal shelters just because these 'ADD hyper nutcase' dogs are in fact excellent, high drive dogs with incredible work ethic - they are not pet quality because of their high drives but are excellent for law enforcement, SAR, etc). I also don't see why you would want TWO GSDs - getting two pups at once is not a good thing to do, esp not with GSDs. Here's my personal experience with my latest german import. I'm sharing this because this is the reality of what you may end up with when you buy workingline GSDs: My guy is a 17 month old german shepherd dog, which I got as a 9wk pup in the last year of my MSc. I'm also starting meds at UofT this fall. My pup's pedigree includes dogs involved with narcotics/SAR/border patrol/schutzhund. By import standards, if you put him on a scale ranging from couch potatoe to gangster-badass-working dog, he is somewhere near the middle, more to the gangster-badass than to the couch potatoe (say 6.5 out of 10). Yet my pup is still a very dominant male all around. He has substantial prey and food drive. He is very sharp (ie he has a low threshold for stimulation, whether excitement or aggression), is territorially dominant, does not like strangers (incl. neighbours, children, friends, relatives), does not like to be petted (except by me), is only bonded to me, is very possessive of me, and is extremely defensive of me. Sounds cool, right? I don't think so. I have had to put an enormous amount of effort into establishing my dominance over him, and laying down his obedience foundation. We're not talking clicker training or treat training. If you're not familiar with the work of Konrad Most or Bill Koehler, then you're not ready for a workingline GSD. You have to keep in mind that Workingline GSDs are bred to be 'manstoppers' ie not afraid to go after humans. They can be a liability if not properly trained. Most dogs are not afraid to bark and chase people, but few will engage a human and lay down a full-mouth bite. Workingline GSDs are bred for 'full mouth' bites. They're bred to nail people, hard. It took a lot of work (major understatement), but now my dog is reliable off-leash in any situation. He rides buses with me, we can walk around busy malls, hospitals, schools, etc. We can go inside stores, and people can pet him if I introduce them properly, but these are all things I've had to train him to do. People with retrievers and other happy-go-lucky dogs are less likely to have to train their dog to accept being petted. Their dogs are more predisposed to be friendly, submissive, gentle. Meanwhile, I've had to train my dog to be these things. Training him probably extended my MSc program by 6 months. But I knew what I was getting into. And, the beauty is that I now have the most wonderful companion I could have ever asked for. Truly my best friend, through and through. I spend more time with him than I do with any of my friends, or even my girlfriend. But I had to put the effort in to earn his respect and trust. You really gotta love dogs, and working dogs, and solving behaviour problems, if you want to get a workingline GSD. I don't worry about him now that med school will start because he's fully trained, calm at home, has his own large fenced enclosure, and can stay at my training club's facility, which is a sprawling ranch, during long days. On the other hand, you may get lucky and your pups may be subdued, sweet, with low drives, low civil aggression, etc, in which case things will be somewhat less difficult (in relative terms - we're talking working shepherds, here). But don't expect it. Prepare for the worst. Bottom line, you better really have a passion for working dogs, and you better go into this purchase thinking that your dog will be an aggressive, noisy, destructive, unmanageable dog, because if you're not committed to training him and building a bond with him, then that's what he will become. And it's not his fault. I also apologize if I sound harsh or abrasive, but again, I'm an advocate for the dog, not the person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnussey Posted August 12, 2009 Report Share Posted August 12, 2009 I have two kids and 1 (soon to be two) guinea pigs...it won't be easy, but I have a husband to support me. I'll have to decide whether or not I'll have day care, a full-time nanny, some day care and some nanny...etc. I'm pretty sure my husband won't be cleaning the piggies so I'll have to do that (lol). It's doable, but you are single...you'll have to try and find someone willing to walk and care for your pups or pay them to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herrry.orason Posted April 14, 2010 Report Share Posted April 14, 2010 Well, during the first few years they are still learning. They may be MDs but they cannot practice on their own. So, they are, in essence getting educated as part of their compensation. Also, the liability is higher for residents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juicyprunes Posted April 27, 2010 Report Share Posted April 27, 2010 I'm starting a 5-yr surgical residency and I desperately want to adopt a dog... But, will it be unrealistic?! Are there certain breeds of dogs that are more "self-sufficient"/require less attention? Are older dogs more forgiving of owners who are away during the day? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgy_guy23 Posted May 4, 2010 Report Share Posted May 4, 2010 I'm starting a 5-yr surgical residency and I desperately want to adopt a dog... But, will it be unrealistic?! Are there certain breeds of dogs that are more "self-sufficient"/require less attention? Are older dogs more forgiving of owners who are away during the day? Yes some breeds of dogs are much more independent than others...it depends what they were initially bred for. Generally dogs like lap dogs or hunting dogs that are meant to work closely with human companions are less forgiving. The older the dog, the more time they can spend by themselves as well. However, it is not good to leave them alone for extended periods of time. If you have a partner/significant other that is not in med school this is probably the best solution. Or good friend/family members if that is possible in your situation. You could even try to find a nice elderly neighbor and either offer them money or they may just do it, especially if your dog is smaller/easier to handle versus a ginormous breed like a Great Dane for instance. Even a simple half an hour-hour walk/play/bathroom break twice a day during the time you are away would suffice. The other good solution some people consider is getting two dogs who can keep each other company. The problem with dogs is that they thrive on a consistent schedule/routine. Thus, if their life is unpredicatable and always changing, they will subsequently get very stressed and it may manifest itself in behavioral issues or physiological health problems. Your best bet will be a smaller breed with a low-low/medium energy profile. Any athletic breed will not do well having to be inside all day and you will likely not have adequate time to give them several hours of active exercise per day which is effectively what they need. Also go for a quieter breed - some groups such as terrier dogs are prone to bark and be quite loud - and if left alone for long periods their frustration and boredom may manifest itself into constant barking which will undoubtedly upset your neighbors. Always make sure to leave a huge bowl of clean water, and a high quality food since this way you will only need to feed them once a day (as an adult). Google "howell book of dogs torrent" and download it. It has a profile of 300 dog breeds. You can also research different dog breeds and find out which ones are best for your situation (apartment, house etc)... If you have no time to train a puppy (which is extremely time consuming and it sounds like it is probably not the best choice for your situation), your best bet is to either get a rescue dog (but the potential issue here is that many have either health or behavior problems or both) or get an adult dog from owners who can no longer hold on to them (Kijiji website is probably a really good resource). This way you can meet the owners and their dog, maybe even have a trial (few days) to see if the dog will work out. The most important traits you are looking for is a low anxiety, smaller sized, lower energy breed that is relatively independent and does not bark very much etc. If going this route make sure the owners can give you the most updated vet records for the dog, and opt for a neutered/spayed dog since you do not want to pay for the operation down the road or indvertently have a bunch of new puppies to deal with. Hope this helps. Let me know if you have any more questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flying kumquat Posted May 6, 2010 Report Share Posted May 6, 2010 I'm starting a 5-yr surgical residency and I desperately want to adopt a dog... But, will it be unrealistic?! Are there certain breeds of dogs that are more "self-sufficient"/require less attention? Are older dogs more forgiving of owners who are away during the day? I assume you know this, but just in case... There is no dog that will tolerate your being away 30+ hours while you're on call. You WILL be on call that long as a surgical (or any) resident, doesn't matter what PAIRO/your provincial union says. If you are the sole caretaker of this dog, I don't think adopting is a feasible plan. With the addition of dog walkers, doggy daycare, etc., it may be doable. As far as more relaxed and readily adoptable dogs go, I'd recommend a greyhound. Sweet as anything. Huge couch potatoes who come crate trained. Due to their upbringing around the track, they sometimes have to be taught "dog-like" behaviour e.g. this is how you play, this is how you catch a ball. Also, they absolutely can't be left off-leash in an unenclosed area (e.g. unfenced dog parks). Like any dog, there are pros and cons with the breed, but I'd encourage you to take a look at them if you think a dog is still for you, overall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juicyprunes Posted May 6, 2010 Report Share Posted May 6, 2010 Thanks for the advice guys! I think I'll have to see how the first couple of months of residency go... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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