Residency in the United States

[Kim]

I'm a Canadian citizen. If I attend medical school in Canada, can I do my residency in the United States afterwards? Is it hard to get this residency? Please let me know.

[Wut?]

You will need to write your USMLE to apply to American programs.

[Viggy]

if you are a green card holder does it make it easier to match your residency in the US compared to Canada?

[Jochi1543]

if you are a green card holder does it make it easier to match your residency in the US compared to Canada?

 

Having a green card will make matching in the US a lot easier than not having one - less paperwork and financial pressure on the program. However, overall I don't think you'll have an easier time matching in the US. True, they have way more spots, so if you are gunning for a super-competitive specialty (e.g. dermatology), you have more programs to choose from. But US programs LOVE their USMLE scores, so if you don't score very well, you won't be very competitive. Based on anecdotal evidence from acquaintances in upper years in Canada who've written the USMLEs, Canadians don't do all that well on them, because our curriculums are not very heavy on basic science (USMLE tests a lot of that). I have several friends at US schools and they do an obscene amount of basic science in their preclinical years, memorizing large amounts of irrelevant minutiae. Our curriculum is also not timed for USMLE writing, whereas Americans get several weeks off right before the USMLE exam just to review. So you are very much on your own when it comes to covering all that extra material, which makes it tougher to blow the exam out of the water.

[Viggy]

Having a green card will make matching in the US a lot easier than not having one - less paperwork and financial pressure on the program. However, overall I don't think you'll have an easier time matching in the US. True, they have way more spots, so if you are gunning for a super-competitive specialty (e.g. dermatology), you have more programs to choose from. But US programs LOVE their USMLE scores, so if you don't score very well, you won't be very competitive. Based on anecdotal evidence from acquaintances in upper years in Canada who've written the USMLEs, Canadians don't do all that well on them, because our curriculums are not very heavy on basic science (USMLE tests a lot of that). I have several friends at US schools and they do an obscene amount of basic science in their preclinical years, memorizing large amounts of irrelevant minutiae. Our curriculum is also not timed for USMLE writing, whereas Americans get several weeks off right before the USMLE exam just to review. So you are very much on your own when it comes to covering all that extra material, which makes it tougher to blow the exam out of the water.

 

wow, awesome answer thanks. so, in canada, is there any test or a particular thing they use when it comes to residency matching for a competitive residency?

 

and i expect to have a green card by the time i finish undergrad. i plan to go to undergrad in ontario, so will this make it easier for me to apply to med schools in the US and how much easier? (minor or an enormous difference)

 

thanks a lot in advance

[ontariostudent]

wow, awesome answer thanks. so, in canada, is there any test or a particular thing they use when it comes to residency matching for a competitive residency?

 

and i expect to have a green card by the time i finish undergrad. i plan to go to undergrad in ontario, so will this make it easier for me to apply to med schools in the US and how much easier? (minor or an enormous difference)

 

thanks a lot in advance

 

In Canada the residency match happens BEFORE you write the board exams, so there's no test you can take to make yourself more competitive.

 

How will you be getting a green card? My guess is that it won't really affect your ability to get into schools in the US bec many places consider Canadians to be out of state anyway. Unless you're living in the state where you want to go to school, having a green card probably won't be that useful for med admissions.

[Viggy]

In Canada the residency match happens BEFORE you write the board exams, so there's no test you can take to make yourself more competitive.

 

How will you be getting a green card? My guess is that it won't really affect your ability to get into schools in the US bec many places consider Canadians to be out of state anyway. Unless you're living in the state where you want to go to school, having a green card probably won't be that useful for med admissions.

 

i will become a green card holder since we applied a really long time ago and the process should come to an end soon.

 

but won't a green card make me considered a permanent resident? so i won't be considered international anymore, right? and, yea i'd be considered out of state regardless because i won't be living there, but at least i'd be a permanent resident, in terms of having a green card.

 

but idk how this will help me out to get into med school in the US and how big of a difference it makes.

 

also, in the US, do you need to have permanent residence or have citizenship to be able to apply to all residencies? like i know some need you to have at least a green card....

[ontariostudent]

i will become a green card holder since we applied a really long time ago and the process should come to an end soon.

 

but won't a green card make me considered a permanent resident? so i won't be considered international anymore, right? and, yea i'd be considered out of state regardless because i won't be living there, but at least i'd be a permanent resident, in terms of having a green card.

 

but idk how this will help me out to get into med school in the US and how big of a difference it makes.

 

also, in the US, do you need to have permanent residence or have citizenship to be able to apply to all residencies? like i know some need you to have at least a green card....

 

As I said, many US schools consider Canadians to be out of state and not internationals, so it shouldn't give you that much of an advantage to have a green card...

[Jochi1543]

wow, awesome answer thanks. so, in canada, is there any test or a particular thing they use when it comes to residency matching for a competitive residency?

 

and i expect to have a green card by the time i finish undergrad. i plan to go to undergrad in ontario, so will this make it easier for me to apply to med schools in the US and how much easier? (minor or an enormous difference)

 

thanks a lot in advance

 

I would probably chill, finish undergrad, get a med acceptance somewhere and THEN think about tests for competitive residencies.

[trymeover]

Having a green card will make matching in the US a lot easier than not having one - less paperwork and financial pressure on the program. However, overall I don't think you'll have an easier time matching in the US. True, they have way more spots, so if you are gunning for a super-competitive specialty (e.g. dermatology), you have more programs to choose from. But US programs LOVE their USMLE scores, so if you don't score very well, you won't be very competitive. Based on anecdotal evidence from acquaintances in upper years in Canada who've written the USMLEs, Canadians don't do all that well on them, because our curriculums are not very heavy on basic science (USMLE tests a lot of that). I have several friends at US schools and they do an obscene amount of basic science in their preclinical years, memorizing large amounts of irrelevant minutiae. Our curriculum is also not timed for USMLE writing, whereas Americans get several weeks off right before the USMLE exam just to review. So you are very much on your own when it comes to covering all that extra material, which makes it tougher to blow the exam out of the water.

 

Hey Jochi, I didn't exactly get what you meant there... So it's easier, but not a whole lot easier?

[Jochi1543]

Hey Jochi, I didn't exactly get what you meant there... So it's easier, but not a whole lot easier?

 

It's more likely to be harder in the US (depending on the specialty and your USMLE score), although having a green card makes it less hard.

[avenir001]

I think jochi's now ready to design the VR section of the MCAT.

[Viggy]

oh aight thanks. but, don't only state funded US universities care if your in-state or out of state? like the private ones wouldn't care would they, like a Harvard or Princeton or w/e?

 

and just out of curiosity, how do they do residency matching in Canada? Like, if the US writes USMLE, and in Canada residency matching happens before the major tests...then what do we use here in Canada? just Med School GPA or something....?

[future_doc]

I think jochi's now ready to design the VR section of the MCAT.

 

The timing may be good as isn't there going to be an overhaul of the MCAT soon?

[Kim]

Thanks for hijacking my post.

[ontariostudent]

oh aight thanks. but, don't only state funded US universities care if your in-state or out of state? like the private ones wouldn't care would they, like a Harvard or Princeton or w/e?

 

and just out of curiosity, how do they do residency matching in Canada? Like, if the US writes USMLE, and in Canada residency matching happens before the major tests...then what do we use here in Canada? just Med School GPA or something....?

 

Since most canadian schools are purely pass/fail, they don't use that either . My guess is that CV, references, and interviews will make or break it for you.

[Viggy]

Since most canadian schools are purely pass/fail, they don't use that either . My guess is that CV, references, and interviews will make or break it for you.

 

wow, that seems a lot easier than writing all the USMLE and going through that entire process in the US

 

so, is there a site that shows stats on residency matching and stuff in Canada. i just wanna get an idea of how competitive the competitive residencies are to get into. thanks

 

oh and wat does CV stand for

[ontariostudent]

I'm a Canadian citizen. If I attend medical school in Canada, can I do my residency in the United States afterwards? Is it hard to get this residency? Please let me know.

 

Sorry we hijacked your thread, Kim, but we managed to answer some of your questions here.

 

It is possible to do residency in the US if you did medical school in Canada. You will need to write the USMLE in order to do so. The USMLE is the US licensing exam, which has 3 parts. The important one for residency is the Step 1, which is usually written after 2nd year of med.

 

The USMLE is fundamentally different from the Canadian licensing exams and tests a LOT of basic science. Because Canadian schools don't teach towards the USMLE, you will likely have to do a lot of prep work on your own in order to do well. If you're interested in doing residency in the US, you might choose a Canadian medical school that has a greater basic science program, and one that is 4 years instead of 3 (since it's usually written between pre-clerkship and clerkship). Another major difference between the USMLE and the Canadian licensing exams is that your score on the USMLE is really important- a higher score means you'll have a better chance at a competitive specialty. In Canada, our licensing exam is taken AFTER the CaRMS match and it's pass/fail.

 

So IF you take the USMLE and do well you can potentially do residency in the US. The next hurdle you will have is that schools will usually prefer an American citizen over a Canadian citizen, because Canadians come with visa issues. So, if a Canadian and an American apply with the exact same application, the American will most likely get the spot, just because it's less of a headache. This means that if you're set on going to the US, especially for something competitive, you would need to really do well on the USMLE and have a stellar application otherwise. If you want something that's not competitive, you have a better chance of matching. This is what Jochi was getting at.

 

The last thing you need to take into account is that the American match usually takes place after the Canadian match, and you can only enter one match at a time. If you match to a Canadian position, you will effectively withdraw from the American match.

 

Lets say you interview in 3 places in the US and 5 in Canada. You then have to make a rank list for each country separately.

 

Lets say you choose to stay in BOTH matches...

 

On CaRMS day you match to your 5th Canadian choice. You are now officially withdrawn from the American match, even though your top American choice wanted you and you would prefer it over your 5th Canadian choice.

 

Or, on CaRMS day you don't match. You now are eligible for the American match and you get your 3rd choice.

 

Or, you don't match on CaRMS day, nor do you match in the US. You can now try to get a second round match.

 

Let's say you are in LOVE with the American schools and would be happier at any of them than you would be in Canada. You would withdraw from CaRMS and HOPE that the American schools will want you. If not, you go unmatched and you have to go through the second match, even if the Canadian schools liked you.

[future_doc]

Thanks for hijacking my post.

 

( K i m )

[ontariostudent]

wow, that seems a lot easier than writing all the USMLE and going through that entire process in the US

 

so, is there a site that shows stats on residency matching and stuff in Canada. i just wanna get an idea of how competitive the competitive residencies are to get into. thanks

 

oh and wat does CV stand for

 

lol.

 

There IS a website (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=canadian+medical+residency+match&l=1) but it's WAY too early for you to be looking at it. How do I know? Because you don't know what CV stands for (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=what+does+cv+stand+for%3F)

 

While some specialties are always competitive, others change from year to year. You still have a LONGGGGG way to go before you participate in CaRMS, so don't worry about competition and try instead to truly find out what you're interested in. Once you have your heart set on something, you can start worrying about whether or not you'll get it.

 

PS. If you can look something up yourself, do it. It's the kind of skill everyone needs to learn if they want to succeed. That goes for using the "search" function on this website. Everything you asked has been discussed here before.

[Viggy]

lmao, that link for google was hilarious, thanks a lot for all the help...truly appreciate it!

[future_doc]

lol.

 

There IS a website (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=canadian+medical+residency+match&l=1) but it's WAY too early for you to be looking at it. How do I know? Because you don't know what CV stands for (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=what+does+cv+stand+for%3F)

 

PS. If you can look something up yourself, do it. It's the kind of skill everyone needs to learn if they want to succeed. That goes for using the "search" function on this website. Everything you asked has been discussed here before.

 

While some specialties are always competitive, others change from year to year. You still have a LONGGGGG way to go before you participate in CaRMS, so don't worry about competition and try instead to truly find out what you're interested in. Once you have your heart set on something, you can start worrying about whether or not you'll get it.

 

ontariostudent

[Kim]

Thanks, ontariostudent. You gave lengthy, but helpful info. However, do you know what Canadian medical schools have a basic science program?

[ontariostudent]

The more "traditional" schools will have more of a focus on basic science. McGill and U of T are two that come to mind. These have a greater focus on classroom teaching (as opposed to PBL). I would not recommend Mac or Calgary (since they're very untraditional, 3 year programs) if you plan to do residency in the US, though I'm sure there have been people to successfully do so. Just take a look at the curricula of the schools where you're accepted and choose the one that makes the most sense for you overall. If you're only accepted at a less traditional school, don't give up your chance to do medicine in Canada.

[Typical Premed]

Hey Kim, I'm wondering why you're so set on doing residency in the US?