1234 Posted April 26, 2012 Report Share Posted April 26, 2012 This is how they are going to deal with the backlog of trainees... scare a good portion of the physicians out of the country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holiday1001 Posted April 26, 2012 Report Share Posted April 26, 2012 ontario is going down the hole. the drummond report pretty much officialized that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrispaul3 Posted April 29, 2012 Report Share Posted April 29, 2012 Most of the time I've got a phone call, asked if I had a time exposure of the project. They are up on year-end need and exhausting their budget. We will talk about the project, and comfortable to projects is the only way, if I had written into the contract, implementation of recommendations, 3-6 months of window.Other job I had in the period, but I will make a fortune doing all these projects. _______________________ トリーバーチ ラバーシューズ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
future_doc Posted April 29, 2012 Report Share Posted April 29, 2012 Wow. If I'm successful at getting into med school, I'm working in Alberta! Considering that is where you would also receive your education, likely do your residency, it makes sense on more than one level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostintime Posted May 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 Our health minister is a piece of work. Awesomeness. Really, personally as a future physician, I'll be lying if I say I don't care about the actual money, but I think after reading the crap she's saying, I agree with the OMA president, she has absolutely no respect for physicians. At least if you're going to have a stance, have some good arguments (and there are some good arguments that physician salaries are going down), but to imply that everyone is just money hungry is extremely rude. As if she's not or else she wouldn't have had her part in ORNGE. It does suck to work in a province where the government treats you like dirt and you can tell how much respect (contempt really) she has for doctors and how much they make. http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/politics/article/1169294--ontario-doctors-say-longer-wait-times-come-with-government-cuts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
future_doc Posted May 2, 2012 Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 As s future physician, my options are to set up practice anywhere in Canada or in USA. Ontario is off my list of options. One step at a time. But for sure, I do not intend to allow myself to become a hostage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostintime Posted May 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 http://www.lfpress.com/news/london/2012/05/01/19704581.html This one has more quotes. Well it kinda really sucks for the patients living in Ontario, including my own family members. That no one really cares about their health and I think both parties do play a role in this -- government just wants to find a scapegoat for their corruption/efficiencies/money wasting while doctors for valid reasons or not, are unlikely altruistic enough that they will stay in Ontario to be BOTH treated like dirt AND paid less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
preppy038 Posted May 2, 2012 Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 seriously, time to vote'em out mcguinty screwed with the province for far too long Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaronjw Posted May 2, 2012 Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 seriously, time to vote'em out mcguinty screwed with the province for far too long Not that I disagree because I hate that prick with an absolute passion (next being Harper) but who do you suggest? All the Ontario leaders are absolute trolling idiots with NO serious plan for Ontario. Sad that this is the best that we have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
future_doc Posted May 2, 2012 Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 President of OMA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostintime Posted May 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 Just to let everyone know: The gov. plans to make the biggest cuts to primary care, while imaging and GI will remain relatively untouched. Another reason to avoid FP. And I am not going to practice in Ontario. That's done. Well that's probably because there's not enough radiologists or ophtho's to really give them enough cash to buy that luxury car or ski resort chalet. There are a lot of GP's though who can take the hit. Really sad for the medical profession, who has won so much in the recent years recruiting people to primary care only to have these people ruin it. (and yeah you can say politically correct stuff like how people should go into primary care for genuine, non-monetary reasons, but at the end of the day, everyone is human). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaronjw Posted May 2, 2012 Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 President of OMA I don't think so. If he was such a good candidate for such a position he would have fought tooth and nail with his members for true primary care reform in Ontario in a manner that's best served for ALL. He's as political as actual politicians and union leaders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futureGP Posted May 2, 2012 Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 that doesn't sound good... i'm really debating between FM and IM... and if general practice is gonna get hit from this budget and on in ontario..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
preppy038 Posted May 2, 2012 Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 is that really true? matthews seems to be promoting the idea that she's planning on cutting the fees for imaging + ophthal though you can never trust a politician, i was hopeful that primary care wouldn't get hit (no offense radio/ophthal) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaronjw Posted May 2, 2012 Report Share Posted May 2, 2012 is that really true? matthews seems to be promoting the idea that she's planning on cutting the fees for imaging + ophthal though you can never trust a politician, i was hopeful that primary care wouldn't get hit (no offense radio/ophthal) as I understand, the OMA made concessions on FFS for reductions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lactic Folly Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 And I am not going to practice in Ontario. That's done. Where to, then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostintime Posted May 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Did she ever source where she is pulling numbers off from (besides her behind)? At least the OMA president gives a source. She keeps going on and on about how Ontario the best place in the world to work and even if you paid physicians close to nothing, they should beg her to work in the all mighty Ontario geez. It's her attitude that's really sickening. Then she puts out all this nauseating fakeness about how she really respects doctors and Dr. Kennedy. SURE, that's why she basically insults every physician in Ontario by calling them money bags. Uh huh. And then she goes "Sure I respect them, but that doesn't mean they deserve more money." Well, I'm honest and I don't respect her AND I don't think she deserves any of her money by basically being a professional liar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futureGP Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Did she ever source where she is pulling numbers off from (besides her behind)? At least the OMA president gives a source. She keeps going on and on about how Ontario the best place in the world to work and even if you paid physicians close to nothing, they should beg her to work in the all mighty Ontario geez. It's her attitude that's really sickening. Then she puts out all this nauseating fakeness about how she really respects doctors and Dr. Kennedy. SURE, that's why she basically insults every physician in Ontario by calling them money bags. Uh huh. And then she goes "Sure I respect them, but that doesn't mean they deserve more money." Well, I'm honest and I don't respect her AND I don't think she deserves any of her money by basically being a professional liar. lol yeah ~$380000 average? seriously? If that's really true, the mean isn't really representative of the data, the distribution curve is probably skewed to the right with the median being somewhat more representative (~250 000?) of the whole MD population (family doctors) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Hood Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 I don't get what she's complaining about, physicians already agreed to a wage freeze, all they are asking for is more money for recruitment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigM Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 I don't get what she's complaining about, physicians already agreed to a wage freeze, all they are asking for is more money for recruitment. It would be hard for her to sell that to the public. Her message is "physicians won't accept a wage freeze" insisting that many other public service employees are having their wages frozen as well. It's tricky manipulation of her message. You cannot hire more individuals, pay the same amount in total and claim that it's a wage freeze, it is a reduction in wages for individual physicians. It's easier for her to tell the public that they are FREEZING our wages instead of cutting our wages. You probably wouldn't see something like this done with teachers, nurses or any most other groups of public service workers. If they every tried to do that to those groups then there would be expectations that the work load would be reduced to reflect the change in wage. She is treating physicians as a collective body in cases where it supports her message. By keeping physicians at the same wage and hiring more physicians she is screaming that physicians are demanding more money. I would argue this isn't the case as individually we aren't asking for any increase. I can't think of any public systems where you could have 9 employees and pay them $10,000 each then hire a 10th employee, pay them $9,000 each but make each individual work the same amount or more. That said, we are essentially contract workers and we are in this position because the terms on contracts can change. As others have pointed out, worst of all is her lack of respect for physicians. You can't say that you respect physicians then claim that they are all corrupt and care only about money in the same paragraph. She is waging a public relations battle to turn the public against physicians for fiscal savings. Even if she wins this and pockets some budget for it, turning the public against physicians is likely to cost our province in the long run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaronjw Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Don't disagree but the OMA is horribly representing the factual side of the argument. Oh and wages are trying to be frozen for teachers. It would be hard for her to sell that to the public. Her message is "physicians won't accept a wage freeze" insisting that many other public service employees are having their wages frozen as well. It's tricky manipulation of her message. You cannot hire more individuals, pay the same amount in total and claim that it's a wage freeze, it is a reduction in wages for individual physicians. It's easier for her to tell the public that they are FREEZING our wages instead of cutting our wages. You probably wouldn't see something like this done with teachers, nurses or any most other groups of public service workers. If they every tried to do that to those groups then there would be expectations that the work load would be reduced to reflect the change in wage. She is treating physicians as a collective body in cases where it supports her message. By keeping physicians at the same wage and hiring more physicians she is screaming that physicians are demanding more money. I would argue this isn't the case as individually we aren't asking for any increase. I can't think of any public systems where you could have 9 employees and pay them $10,000 each then hire a 10th employee, pay them $9,000 each but make each individual work the same amount or more. That said, we are essentially contract workers and we are in this position because the terms on contracts can change. As others have pointed out, worst of all is her lack of respect for physicians. You can't say that you respect physicians then claim that they are all corrupt and care only about money in the same paragraph. She is waging a public relations battle to turn the public against physicians for fiscal savings. Even if she wins this and pockets some budget for it, turning the public against physicians is likely to cost our province in the long run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigM Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Don't disagree but the OMA is horribly representing the factual side of the argument. Oh and wages are trying to be frozen for teachers. Yes, but for teachers it will be an actual freeze (i.e. payment stays the same, number of teachers stays the same, wage stages the same). For doctors it will be a pay cut. Should the government have their way, new doctors will start practicing, the total number of physicians will increase, billing codes will be reduced and alternative funding plans will be cut back. For teachers the issue will be that there will be no increase in the overall number of teachers (still a big issue since getting a teaching job has been extremely hard in past years). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaronjw Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Yes, but for teachers it will be an actual freeze (i.e. payment stays the same, number of teachers stays the same, wage stages the same). For doctors it will be a pay cut. Should the government have their way, new doctors will start practicing, the total number of physicians will increase, billing codes will be reduced and alternative funding plans will be cut back. For teachers the issue will be that there will be no increase in the overall number of teachers (still a big issue since getting a teaching job has been extremely hard in past years). They can try to legislate billing codes being reduced but as independent contractors to the gov't physicians are free to do what they want. As I've said before, collectively physicians should come together and simply start conforming to traditional work week hours. Let's see what happens when hundred's of thousands of man-hours are lost in a system that doesn't have enough to accommodate everyone to begin with. You want your reductions gov't? No problem, you got it. Now call us unprofessional because we're not willing to work the extended hours to ensure health care doesn't grind to a halt. We're doing our part to lower our financial burden on the system because, as you know, as ONLY get paid when we SEE a patient. How about the gov't ask citizens to stop going to the doctor so much? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1234 Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 are class sizes still increasing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Hood Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 The OMA is not helping, the way they are talking, they make it seem that physicians only care about money, and don't care about patients (like when they say the wait will be longer). For the average Joe, you guys are making 300k/year (especially with the figure the Minister gave), and physicians want to neglect their patients because they will earn 250k/years (and for the average Joe, that's too much) => physicians are greedy and only care about money. Also, it's not hard for the gov't to turn the public against you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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