Newbie1234 Posted November 9, 2006 Report Share Posted November 9, 2006 Hey all, I'm in my 2nd year and I'm interested in pursuing a chem degree. Although I AM interested in the subject due to its mixture of math, concepts and problem solving, organic chem was one of my lower marks last year. So my question is, are those other courses in chemistry (analytical, inorganic, physical) anything like the straight memorization involved in organic chem? Any chem majors out there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuantum Posted November 9, 2006 Report Share Posted November 9, 2006 First of all, organic chemistry is NOT straight memorization. It is a lot of qualitative problem solving that you experience in the introductory course. However, if you are really are into the math and PHYSICS, then maybe pursuing a Chemistry degree may be for you. I love Biochemistry and Organic Chemistry, however, I took those last year so I am currently enrolled in physical and inorganic chemistry. Let's just say I am not having the best year...in fact, I'd say this is the worst year with those two courses being listed as 2 and 3 as the reasons why. I am upper level Biochem courses and I love those, so it honestly just depends on the person. If you are into that stuff, go for it, but remember Chemistry is actually pretty intense. If you are not interested in that stuff, it will make your life miserable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muchdutch Posted November 9, 2006 Report Share Posted November 9, 2006 Yes, newbie, there's lots of chem out there for you - more for you than for the organics lovers, I think. While I'm not a chem major, I have taken more chem than I care to have seen. I am currently enrolled in a quantitative analytical chem class (memorization and math). I have also taken advanced transition metal chem which was much more of the conceptual learning you have in organic chem, yet still considered inorganic (all about bonding of transition metals, chelation, energy states, etc.). This course is still primarily memorization. The labs were fun though - playing with colored shiny stuff - red! green! yellow! Like Kuantum said, if you aren't interested, it will make your life miserable. And while you may have enjoyed first year, I find the senior years can be quite different from first year. You will never know until you try it out though, so ask around, pick a course that sounds interesting to you, and you'll have a better idea as to whether you want it to be your major once you've completed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avenir001 Posted November 9, 2006 Report Share Posted November 9, 2006 I agree with the comments above...only pursue chem if you're truly interested in it because it's intense. I also want to add that my experience with upper-level chem courses has depended a lot on how good/effective the profs have been at teaching & testing. For instance, a prof we had for our 3rd yr physical chem was just awful...he'd make mistakes while teaching and his notes which he'd write on the board were messy & confusing...the textbook was difficult to read but it was my only hope...I ended up spending as much time studying for this course as I did for my other 4 courses combined. The final was TOO LONG & HARD...the class avg was 61% and many ppl failed the course. We complained to the department...to no avail. Moral of the story: probably a good idea to do some research on the chem department/profs, ask upper-level students about their experiences/satisfaction and check the profs' ratings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a41 Posted November 9, 2006 Report Share Posted November 9, 2006 I'm an Engineering Chemistry major (dually accredited Chemical Engineering and Chemistry program). If I had to choose between the two, I would pick chemical engineering over chemistry. Chemistry is intense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
everyoneloveschem Posted November 9, 2006 Report Share Posted November 9, 2006 Be still my beating heart...someone who WANTS to do a chem degree? I majored in chemistry. If you have specifics questions let me know. Remember it will be different depending on your school and profs. That aside...In terms of picking a major, I agree with the other posters, pick something you enjoy. You will not likely love every course required for every major, but you should be interested in most of the subjects covered. In chem you usually have to do a certain number of required general chem classes (organic, inorganic, physical - thermodynamics/quantum, and analytical) plus the associated labs. After that, in third and fourth year, you usually have the chance to pick from a variety of courses, tailored to your interests, be that organic chemistry or physical chemistry (which is what I did). If you are afraid of choosing chemistry because of organic chemistry, that seems silly, unless you REALLY hate it. You probably have to take 3 organic chem classes in total, after that you can focus on whatever you want. I liked chemistry because it wasn't all memorization (the way biology seemed to be) but not all math (the way physics is) and I wanted to do sciences. I have never heard of biochemistry, and looking back, I might have pursued that instead, but through chem I was able to take biochem classes without being forced to take tons of biology. I think it depends on what you enjoy and the way your mind works. One of the best courses I took was on analyzing organic chemicals using IR, NMR and MS, it was great, like doing puzzles all the time. For med school...chem might not be the most obvious, but as long as you do the pre-reqs it shouldn't matter. That said, there are certain courses you would likely/could take with other majors that would make your life easier in med school, such as immunology, anatomy, pharmacology, etc. Thing is, you could always take those as electives (if you are a glutton for punishment ). Okay, enough rambling. Good luck with the choice. (Go chem go!!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimmyMax Posted November 9, 2006 Report Share Posted November 9, 2006 Hey, I agree with everyoneloveschem. Chemistry is easy (for me, anyway)- if you do the work and don't leave it until the final exam, or even if you do leave it to the final exam (like I did), you'll be fine. I can't see how everyone describes it as being intense- I mean, sure it has labs and lab reports, but going into a department such as chemistry, I can't see how you would be surprised by this. You knew this perfectly well when you signed up for it. That's like being a surgeon and not having outpatient clinics! Rather than complaining about the labs and worrying about whether you can get out early or not, I'd immerse myself in the experiment and see if I could actually learn something during the 3 or 4 hours that I'm trapped in the lab rather than whining about how long the experiments take. Another reason why I liked chemistry so much is because it was a lot of application and not rote memorization, unlike most biology courses. There was some easy math in there, which wasn't bad either. Plus the material was inherently interesting, which didn't hurt things in the least! So yeah, chemistry is great. You should take it. You're going to work hard, but what do you expect when you get to medical school??? I found that my chemsitry experience during undergrad prepared me very nicely for medical school- the workload was actually less than during undergrad! P.S.: Thanks to everyoneloveschem for representing. There's a gross overabundance of whining about organic chemistry on this forum, I've noticed! It's not that hard...honestly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
show24 Posted November 9, 2006 Report Share Posted November 9, 2006 I agree with everyone's comments, if you're going to be in chemistry you have to enjoy it and if you enjoy it then you won't be annoyed about the 3 and 4 hour labs plus the 3-4 hours analyzing each lab. You'll like it a lot if you go into it thinking that it's going to be interesting. HOWEVER...as a chemistry major, I like chem...but I can't freaking stand Physical Chem. I'm in my last year and having a very easy time (I saved my slack gen-ed courses for now) with the exception of Physical Chemistry...maybe it's a tough course or maybe my mind is burnt out from 3 years of chemistry stuff...who knows....all I know is that I have fun in chemistry but the only fun I have in P-chem is laughing when the prof screws up his ClausClap calcs and doesn't know what the hell is going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimmyMax Posted November 10, 2006 Report Share Posted November 10, 2006 Hey, I have to admit that Physical Chemistry does kind of suck... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Law Posted November 10, 2006 Report Share Posted November 10, 2006 Hey, I agree with everyoneloveschem. Chemistry is easy (for me, anyway)- if you do the work and don't leave it until the final exam, or even if you do leave it to the final exam (like I did), you'll be fine. I can't see how everyone describes it as being intense- I mean, sure it has labs and lab reports, but going into a department such as chemistry, I can't see how you would be surprised by this. You knew this perfectly well when you signed up for it. That's like being a surgeon and not having outpatient clinics! Rather than complaining about the labs and worrying about whether you can get out early or not, I'd immerse myself in the experiment and see if I could actually learn something during the 3 or 4 hours that I'm trapped in the lab rather than whining about how long the experiments take. Another reason why I liked chemistry so much is because it was a lot of application and not rote memorization, unlike most biology courses. There was some easy math in there, which wasn't bad either. Plus the material was inherently interesting, which didn't hurt things in the least! So yeah, chemistry is great. You should take it. You're going to work hard, but what do you expect when you get to medical school??? I found that my chemsitry experience during undergrad prepared me very nicely for medical school- the workload was actually less than during undergrad! P.S.: Thanks to everyoneloveschem for representing. There's a gross overabundance of whining about organic chemistry on this forum, I've noticed! It's not that hard...honestly! Amen!!! haha I love chemistry. It's so much fun to do... it's just really cool. Even organic chemistry, it just shows you how amazingly complicated, yet simple nature is. Do what your heart tells you to do. Are you good at chem? Do you like doing it? You might wanna check out some upper year courses and see if they appeal to you. Chemistry isn't as bad as people make it out to be. Just work really hard, and try to understand rather than memorize it... and you'll be fine. Anyway, I say go for it... if that's what you like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
everyoneloveschem Posted November 10, 2006 Report Share Posted November 10, 2006 Timmy, no probs, I'm all about the chem. Can't let people diss it (I let the orgo comments slide because I know they just indicate an inherent weakness of character rather than the truth). Physical chemistry is just like any other chemistry - it depends on what you are doing, and who is teaching it. Sure Hamiltonian's may make you want stab pencils in your eyes, but is the citric acid cycle any better? I think my least favourite was the class (inorganic) that I took on atomic orbital theory and state groups. I still shudder to look back. Oh, and no, I didn't choose to take it, it was required. Now I did stupidly use up an elective on a programming course - not recommended by the way. The things you learn as you group up. Take fun courses as your electives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leviathan Posted November 10, 2006 Report Share Posted November 10, 2006 I definitely love chem as well...aced all the chem-related pre-reqs that medical school requires, and if I could go back and do it again I probably would have done a chem major. Hindsight is 20/20 though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkles Posted November 10, 2006 Report Share Posted November 10, 2006 I am also strongly considering doing Chem as my major. I love how it's not like Biology (pure memorization) and not completely like Physics (all math). I also really really enjoy it. Which is the main reason I am considering majoring in it. I'm not as strong at it as I am in other subjects, but like I said....I really enjoy it. That is my dilemna...first and foremost, I want to get into med school, so I'm thinking I should major in the thing that is easiest for me. But I don't want to go through my school years not enjoying what I do. I haven't decided what I am going to do yet, but I think I won't take the easiest path......I want to enjoy what I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Posted November 10, 2006 Report Share Posted November 10, 2006 It is likely that nobody wants to hear another ¨Chem is Great¨ reply but... I majored in physical and theoretical chemistry. I absolutely loved the labs and problem solving. There is also something to be said about the general scientific literacy you will gain from majoring in chemistry. It is not really about choosing a major that will be easiest for you, but choosing one that you will enjoy , which in turn will make it easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimmyMax Posted November 11, 2006 Report Share Posted November 11, 2006 Hey, It is likely that nobody wants to hear another ¨Chem is Great¨ reply but... Completely untrue! This is definitely the right place for 'Chem is great!' replies! Keep 'em coming! I let the orgo comments slide because I know they just indicate an inherent weakness of character rather than the truth LOL!!! So true! I agree that one should choose a major that they will enjoy, which is not necessarily the same thing that they seem to do the best in. As a practical example, I foolishly chose to major in math & bio because I thought that my grossly inflated OAC math marks were representative of my prowess in the subject, even though I liked chem more but my marks in it weren't the greatest (what can I say? I was a young and stupid Grade 12 student when I took OAC Chemistry!). How wrong I was! Life as a math major sucked rocks! There was so much theory and proofs to be done with so little calculations involved, it was simply mind-rotting! Well, maybe not mind-rotting in a 'memorize the Kreb Cycle amd all of its intermediates for tomorrow's exam' kind of way, but definitely heavy and definitely not for me. I promptly dropped the math part for chem (like I should have done from the beginning) and have never looked back! The moral of the story? Don't be afraid to choose to major in something that you're genuinely interested in just because you got higher marks in another subject. With that firmly in mind, I say choose chemistry! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireDragoonX Posted November 11, 2006 Report Share Posted November 11, 2006 removed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuantum Posted November 11, 2006 Report Share Posted November 11, 2006 Labs aren't that big a deal in undergrad. You don't learn much anyways and your results rarely matter anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
everyoneloveschem Posted November 11, 2006 Report Share Posted November 11, 2006 Ahhh Kuantum, you have obviously not taken the full credit, 6 hours per week analytical chemistry lab where you're entire mark is based on how closely your results come to the unknown values. At UofW 98% of our lab marks were separate from our actual class marks, so how well you did in the lab was important to your GPA. Why take chemistry if you aren't going to try in the labs, it is after all chemistry? I love all the hidden chemistry fans out there. Ya'll rock my world. I am now in medicine, so I have something new to introduce myself with, but I hated how when I used to say my major was in chemistry 96.25% of people replied with 'I hated chemistry in high school'. You know what? I hated chemistry in high school too! I just didn't want to do an arts degree, figured fine arts wouldn't get me a job, sucked at physics and had never taken biology, so chemistry it was. What is nice with chemistry is that once you're in, you can shift your focus to where your strengths lie because there is such a range of areas within chemistry. Okay, enough about how great chemistry is (after all, what isn't a chemical?)...I should try and have a life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Law Posted November 11, 2006 Report Share Posted November 11, 2006 Okay, enough about how great chemistry is (after all, what isn't a chemical?)...I should try and have a life. Chemistry is life. hahaha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuantum Posted November 11, 2006 Report Share Posted November 11, 2006 Ahhh Kuantum, you have obviously not taken the full credit, 6 hours per week analytical chemistry lab where you're entire mark is based on how closely your results come to the unknown values. At UofW 98% of our lab marks were separate from our actual class marks, so how well you did in the lab was important to your GPA. Why take chemistry if you aren't going to try in the labs, it is after all chemistry? I love all the hidden chemistry fans out there. Ya'll rock my world. I am now in medicine, so I have something new to introduce myself with, but I hated how when I used to say my major was in chemistry 96.25% of people replied with 'I hated chemistry in high school'. You know what? I hated chemistry in high school too! I just didn't want to do an arts degree, figured fine arts wouldn't get me a job, sucked at physics and had never taken biology, so chemistry it was. What is nice with chemistry is that once you're in, you can shift your focus to where your strengths lie because there is such a range of areas within chemistry. Okay, enough about how great chemistry is (after all, what isn't a chemical?)...I should try and have a life. No I haven't taken analytical...and I hope I never have to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiel Posted November 11, 2006 Report Share Posted November 11, 2006 Does first year chemistry differ that much to the content in grade 12? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimmyMax Posted November 11, 2006 Report Share Posted November 11, 2006 Hey, Yeah, analytical chemistry was pretty intense- so much depended on how accurate your results were that you had to take your time, unless you wanted to do crappy, of course! That said, there was nothing like a sparkling 10/10 for a grueling 4-hour lab session, just like there was no worse feeling than a 2/10 when you messed something up. Constant weight was the absolute bane of my existence back then! Yeah, it definitely wasn't like high school where so long as you didn't blow up the school with your experiment, you got a good grade. There's tons more material, it's a lot harder and you move through it at a much quicker pace. In addition, with university, there's no one checking up on you every day to make sure that you've done all of your homework, lab reports and are well-prepared for the exam. I think that it's the culture shock of going from having your hand held throughout the year and being marked based on who you are as opposed to basically working without a net and the focus being on the actual quality of what you hand in that provides students with the most trouble in the transition from high school to university. That said, chemistry is still all good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Law Posted November 12, 2006 Report Share Posted November 12, 2006 For me it was radically different. In high school I had never done orgo, redox, electrochem, acids and bases... lol all I had done was pretty much stoichiometry... "equilibria" for 2 months (HOW, don't ask)... and atomic trends. Anyway, it was definitely fast paced... but for some reason, I thrived with the pressure of the course. It was my first time learning most of the stuff, but I worked so hard, and it was awesome. Our 1st year chem labs are easy, they don't take off many marks based on inaccurate results (-1 or 2 for low yield). I've always enjoyed chem though, (even in high school) so it wasn't that bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkles Posted November 12, 2006 Report Share Posted November 12, 2006 For me it was radically different. In high school I had never done orgo, redox, electrochem, acids and bases... lol all I had done was pretty much stoichiometry... "equilibria" for 2 months (HOW, don't ask)... and atomic trends. Anyway, it was definitely fast paced... but for some reason, I thrived with the pressure of the course. It was my first time learning most of the stuff, but I worked so hard, and it was awesome. Our 1st year chem labs are easy, they don't take off many marks based on inaccurate results (-1 or 2 for low yield). I've always enjoyed chem though, (even in high school) so it wasn't that bad. In my chem 101 they take off 30% of the grade if your results are too far off what the actual value should be. I think it differs from school to school. And I really hate this because we are first year chem students. I mean......CMON!!! I have 83 % in the lab component....and I should have 90 but because I've been off in my results....my mark suffers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Law Posted November 12, 2006 Report Share Posted November 12, 2006 Aww man that stinks. Yeah, in 1st year the most I lost for results being off is 5%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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