ThomasRolland Posted January 28, 2012 Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 The brain is the most important organ in the body. Yet brain specialist docs (Neurologists, Psychiatrists) are on the lower end of the salary scale... What gives?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rarkon Posted January 28, 2012 Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 There aren't many lucrative procedures/billing codes that can be done quickly in neurology/psych? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebouque Posted January 28, 2012 Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 Most organs in the body are crucial Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLengr Posted January 28, 2012 Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 There aren't many lucrative procedures/billing codes that can be done quickly in neurology/psych? Low number of procedures, long times per appointment. Also, for the most part, they have good lifestyles, so that is valuable in its own right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmorelan Posted January 28, 2012 Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 Low number of procedures, long times per appointment. Also, for the most part, they have good lifestyles, so that is valuable in its own right. There are worse things than a interesting meaningful work, a good salary and m-f, 9-5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medguy5367 Posted January 29, 2012 Report Share Posted January 29, 2012 The brain is the most important organ in the body. Yet brain specialist docs (Neurologists, Psychiatrists) are on the lower end of the salary scale... What gives?? LOL what I found out long ago is that $$$ in med is all about procedures. So a psychiatrist will save lives and work with their patients, do a long interview, do a med follow-up, prescribe new meds, and help them heal, but for all this they won't earn as much. A dermatologist will remove 20 warts, call it a day, and drive home in their Lamborghini. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Let'sGo1990 Posted January 31, 2012 Report Share Posted January 31, 2012 They have a good lifestyle. Even if their pay isn't on par with the rest of the specialties, I still want to be one since I love neurology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dino Posted January 31, 2012 Report Share Posted January 31, 2012 They have a good lifestyle. Even if their pay isn't on par with the rest of the specialties' date=' I still want to be one since I love neurology.[/quote'] Neurologists in the maritimes make quite a bit. $400k+ is not uncommon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfette Posted February 4, 2012 Report Share Posted February 4, 2012 Psychiatrists and neurologists generally speaking don't work particularly long hours and have pretty good call (except if you're doing stroke call), so you have to factor that into the pay scale. Having said that, i think all medical specialties make enough that you will be extremely comfortable. Your happiness level will not be dictated by whether you make $200,000 or $500,000 (even though the actual amount is a lot). Doing work you enjoy, having decent hours, having a good spouse and happy family life, spending time with friends, etc. will dictate your happiness. So if you're lucky enough to be in medicine, focus on these things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
future_doc Posted February 4, 2012 Report Share Posted February 4, 2012 Smurfette, you are right again in saying where the focus should be. The difficulty will be in having a good spouse, easier said than done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IamIDP Posted February 6, 2012 Report Share Posted February 6, 2012 LOL what I found out long ago is that $$$ in med is all about procedures. So a psychiatrist will save lives and work with their patients, do a long interview, do a med follow-up, prescribe new meds, and help them heal, but for all this they won't earn as much. A dermatologist will remove 20 warts, call it a day, and drive home in their Lamborghini. I doubt most doctors can afford lambourghini's. Only the top ~5% specielists can actually afford a car of that calibor in this country. Remember, there are heavy taxes, insurance, and load of other expenses that doctors have to pay. On top of that, new lambo's go for $250,000+ + insurance + 12cylinder gas....and if you crash it....good luck paying the money back P.S. Most (like 99.9%) of the people who drive exotic cars are entrepreneurs, not doctors. 80% of Rolls royce clintal is entroproneurs (I heard from a RR salesperson). Anyways, i'm getting a bit carried away since i'm a car franatic lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLengr Posted February 6, 2012 Report Share Posted February 6, 2012 I doubt most doctors can afford lambourghini's. Only the top ~5% specielists can actually afford a car of that calibor in this country. Remember, there are heavy taxes, insurance, and load of other expenses that doctors have to pay. On top of that, new lambo's go for $250,000+ + insurance + 12cylinder gas....and if you crash it....good luck paying the money back P.S. Most (like 99.9%) of the people who drive exotic cars are entrepreneurs, not doctors. 80% of Rolls royce clintal is entroproneurs (I heard from a RR salesperson). Anyways, i'm getting a bit carried away since i'm a car franatic lol Except you have insurance to pay the money back. There are quite a few Derm people who also own cosmetic medicine side businesses that seem to do quite well. But I agree, most super cars are sold to the ultra wealthy, which physicians generally are not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IamIDP Posted February 6, 2012 Report Share Posted February 6, 2012 Except you have insurance to pay the money back. There are quite a few Derm people who also own cosmetic medicine side businesses that seem to do quite well. But I agree, most super cars are sold to the ultra wealthy, which physicians generally are not. True but the insurance will soar up severely especially when you crash a car like that. Anyways my point is, doctors can't afford lambourghini's unless your a specielist at the top of your field that make a net annual of $400k AFTER taxes + expenses...which is like 0.00001% of doctors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheech10 Posted February 6, 2012 Report Share Posted February 6, 2012 A lot more doctors than you think will net 400K per year, far more than 0.00001%. Cardiology, GI, Nephrology, Radiology, Dermatology, Ophthalmology, and a whole bunch of other surgical specialities make more than 400K net of taxes and expenses. The real question is why would they want a Lambo? Expensive to buy, with rapid depreciation, significant maintenance and insurance costs, and an inability to enjoy it fully within the law (unless going to the track). I could think of many far better ways to spend money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaronjw Posted February 6, 2012 Report Share Posted February 6, 2012 A lot more doctors than you think will net 400K per year, far more than 0.00001%. Cardiology, GI, Nephrology, Radiology, Dermatology, Ophthalmology, and a whole bunch of other surgical specialities make more than 400K net of taxes and expenses. The real question is why would they want a Lambo? Expensive to buy, with rapid depreciation, significant maintenance and insurance costs, and an inability to enjoy it fully within the law (unless going to the track). I could think of many far better ways to spend money. I think we know the answer to this question lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLengr Posted February 6, 2012 Report Share Posted February 6, 2012 Lambo's are over rated. Ferraris are where the action is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moo Posted February 6, 2012 Report Share Posted February 6, 2012 Just for kicks, I once punched in to the Mercedes Benz financial calculator to see what kind of car I could afford. After putting in my downpayment, and my monthly income and monthly expenses (including mortgage), they told me I could afford a SLS AMG (financing, of course). Of course, I would never buy such an expensive car, probably about the worst investment you can make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renin Posted February 6, 2012 Report Share Posted February 6, 2012 LOL; there is ECT in psychiatry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shady Posted February 6, 2012 Report Share Posted February 6, 2012 Surgery specialties pay the most. For the brain, that would be neurosurgeons, and if I'm correct, they are well paid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apache Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 brains the most important part of body, unfortunately, we don't understand the brain very well... so there's ur answer... we understand the heart and circulatory system very well.... and how to do operations on people's bladders The brain is the most important organ in the body. Yet brain specialist docs (Neurologists, Psychiatrists) are on the lower end of the salary scale... What gives?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmorelan Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 brains the most important part of body, unfortunately, we don't understand the brain very well... so there's ur answer... we understand the heart and circulatory system very well.... and how to do operations on people's bladders Yeah - sounds silly but you get paid more if you can truly fix something in some quantifiable way or perform some measurable task. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apache Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 it's true, in 150 years when psychiatry and neurology can parallel the quantitative precision of cardiology and surgery etc. now, psych and neuro will be leaps and bounds the most competitive specialties... psychiatry and neuro are science, but also arts, that's why in the states you also see huge disparities between the best and worst psychs and neuros, you go to a gen surgeon, you have a good idea he knows how to do a surgery, you go to a psychiatrist, that residency could be worth 100 k a year or a million a year, because some people "get it", it's not something you can teach, unlike most "quantifiable" specialties, but it's something some people are just good at, it's like asking a hockey player how they knew there was someone behind them... they can't answer you, they just sort of know, just like some psychs just have an intuitive way of being good at psychiatry... be thankful you're in canada if you go into a brain specialty though, here your bets are hedged, in the states if you suck, your pay will reflect that. Yeah - sounds silly but you get paid more if you can truly fix something in some quantifiable way or perform some measurable task. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebouque Posted February 7, 2012 Report Share Posted February 7, 2012 you go to a psychiatrist, that residency could be worth 100 k a year or a million a year, because some people "get it", it's not something you can teach, unlike most "quantifiable" specialties, but it's something some people are just good at, it's like asking a hockey player how they knew there was someone behind them... they can't answer you, they just sort of know, just like some psychs just have an intuitive way of being good at psychiatry... I really disagree with the fact that psychiatry is more about talent than acquired skills. Some surgeons or internists or pediatricians will be intrinsically better than other. I don't think some psychiatrists have some kind of 6th sense and others don't. Psych is taught in a very objective way (mental exam, DSM, medications). Maybe some THERAPISTS are better than others, but nowadays psychotherapy is more in the realm of psychology than psychiatry (even though psychiatrists can do therapy, as well as other physicians). Now whether psychotherapy should be done by psychiatrists more often rather than psychologists is a whole other debate. Bottom line: yes there is more subjectivity in psychiatry since it's almost entirely based on observation and listening, but the way it's practiced, it remains quite objective, scientific and biological, especially the psychopharmacology part of the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apache Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 lol, i wrote about a 1000 word response to this n my computer ccrashed, but i wont bother re-writing... let's just agree to disagree because your statement doesn't really address my thoughts at all (which is just because i would have to write 10 pages to explain the details of my thesis, which no one wants to read on here), mostly the motives for scientism to dominate psychiatry, how i didn't mean intrinsic talent, rather worldview, previous experiences, and personality (many studies show amount of training has no correlation to success as a mental health professional, which is my only metric), i also tossed in a bit about phenomenology, not having absolute beliefs, having extremely diverse life experiences which make you comfortable with everyone, bringing humanism and the romanticist notion of knowledge acquisition in psychiatry when necessary as well as being able to understand that every action has a rational motivation to the person who did it. add a million other things, don't worry, it's one of those sledgehammers people are like ughh well, no response to that. the thing i didn't end up finishing though was my fervent belief that you can't compartmentalize mentally ill patients, mental illness is so complex that one provider really has to do a lot of the work to be the most effective... imo, separating psychotherapy and psychopharmacology is a fatal flaw (thinking beyond severe bp, schizophrenia, etc. onto generalized anxiety, self esteem, suicidal ideation, panic attacks, conversion stuff, depersonalization, ptsd, adhd, circumstantial depressions, oppositional personalities clinical personality "disorders" (i use quotations because many people live great lives with narcissistic, schizoid, dependent traits, etc. so i prefer the term not to use the term disorder for personality stuff, although, of course, in some cases personality features can cause real problems). as a doctor, your job is to heal, not be a drug dealer, and i'm full for psychopharmacology, but if you think you're going to solve a young mans depression, loneliness, lack of meaning in life, and confidence, with some citalopram, think again... that may be one component, but teaching him social skills, acting out situations, giving him links to low pressure toastmasters groups, even lending the kid a cheap guitar so he can learn a skill, or giving him ideas for a job so he can earn some cash can really benefit... at the end of the day, your purpose isn't to hand out meds, it's to heal the patient, sometimes some lithium and an anti-depressent is all you need, but if that's all you can do, then you're not worth the government's dime. lol, don't bother responding, because i didn't get to say what i wanted too, so it's hard for you to really respond... and we'll just end up miscommunicating and getting in an argument, lol. I really disagree with the fact that psychiatry is more about talent than acquired skills. Some surgeons or internists or pediatricians will be intrinsically better than other. I don't think some psychiatrists have some kind of 6th sense and others don't. Psych is taught in a very objective way (mental exam, DSM, medications). Maybe some THERAPISTS are better than others, but nowadays psychotherapy is more in the realm of psychology than psychiatry (even though psychiatrists can do therapy, as well as other physicians). Now whether psychotherapy should be done by psychiatrists more often rather than psychologists is a whole other debate.Bottom line: yes there is more subjectivity in psychiatry since it's almost entirely based on observation and listening, but the way it's practiced, it remains quite objective, scientific and biological, especially the psychopharmacology part of the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLengr Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 The huge variability we see in psychiatrist quality probably has something to do with our very limited knowledge of the science of the field. As we slowly gain a better understanding of the pathological processes it may be easier to standardize and treat them. Right now we basically just spray the brain with pretty non selective chemicals and hope for the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.