rich parents = med school?

[anon1234]

hi guys

 

i just need someone to discuss this with and i thought this is a good place for it!

 

i'm feeling quite frustrated lately because all around me i see people who are getting into med school just because their parents are richer than mine, and it really frustrates me. i know someone who got into a caribbean med schol straight out of high school, just cause her (very rich) parents knew the guy who was the president of this med school. all her dad had to do was make a call 2 weeks after classes had started and send them a cheque and she was in. whats more is that her high school grades weren't exactly stellar (B average i believe)

 

then i know a guy who got into some school in the UK where tuition is like 60 grand a year.....i know this other kid who got into wayne state where tuition is like 80 grand a year.............and it's not like these people are people with 3.8-3.9 GPAs.....they're very nice people and everything, but i don't know. i feel bad because there is no way in the world i would ever be able to afford even a year of tuition like that, so i find it ridiculous that these people get in so easily and become docs. yes you can say if you're awesome you will get in anyways, but lets face it.....these rich kids (mostly) don't have to work when they are in undergrad, their parents can afford to pay for them to live on rez, and with that comes a lot of advantage in terms of study time.

 

 

i know some people will say it's because of loans, but you need a rich co-signer (with a big bank account) to get a loan in ther first place (especially one that is such a high amount)

 

i'd like to hear some stories of people who are from normal middle class homes like me who got in anyways and for whom money was not an issue. because i look around me and feel like crap.

[ontariostudent]

First of all, if you want to practice in Canada, don't worry about schools in the UK or the Caribbean. While it's possible to go to school there and practice here, it's definitely not the preferred route (meaning there's no guarantee that you'll be able to come back and practice here). American schools are safer options, but yes they are expensive and it will still be harder for you to come back.

 

Canadian schools are quite affordable. The Ontario schools (which tend to be the most expensive in Canada) are about 20k each year but if you qualify for loans (which it sounds like you would), finances should not hold you back at all, especially because if you're in a Canadian school you probably don't need a cosigner for a bank line of credit (though every bank is different and you'll have to shop around to find what you're looking for).

 

The bottom line is that finances should NOT hold you back from medical school in Canada. The only way I could see financial worries interfering is if you need to work full time while in school and it takes away from you having ECs or a good GPA. Yes there are some people who might be able to buy their way into medical school (I don't wish to enter into a discussion about this), it is definitely not how the average person in Canada gets an MD. Worry about yourself and you should be fine.

 

As mentioned in another thread, getting into med in some places may not be so hard, but graduating with an MD and landing a residency spot is entirely different. If the people you mentioned truly aren't qualified, they won't finish as doctors. If they are, you really shouldn't spend your time worrying about how fair it is that they are in medical school.

[future_doc]

Hey anon, I am an immigrant, actually came to Canada as a refugee, signle parent family, no money, so what. Canada is the land of opportunity and there is no better place in the world to live. I have no money, my mother has no money and is always in debt, again, so what. We are fine, I am getting a wonderful education and the glass is full, not half empty or empty. It is for each of us as individuals to make our dreams come true, to create and implement a plan and go for it, not to waste time or energy focusing on the meaningless - if there are others with greater advantages than I have, good for them and may they use their advantages wisely. Focus on yourself and not others. I consider myself fortunate and am carving out my own future by my own effort and lack of money will not be an obstacle. My grandmother escaped at age 50 as a refugee to Canada with no English and no money, she applied to McGill for a 2nd Ph.D., no English but she knew her formulae and math, she got her 2nd Ph.D. in Canada and earned her way working as a student and then doing post-doc work (her English is now excellent, altho with a heavy accent). We all make our own future, it is in our hands, we are solely responsible for what happens to us - no excuses.

[orange123]

Hey anon, I am an immigrant, actually came to Canada as a refugee, signle parent family, no money, so what. Canada is the land of opportunity and there is no better place in the world to live. I have no money, my mother has no money and is always in debt, again, so what. We are fine, I am getting a wonderful education and the glass is full, not half empty or empty. It is for each of us as individuals to make our dreams come true, to create and implement a plan and go for it, not to waste time or energy focusing on the meaningless - if there are others with greater advantages than I have, good for them and may they use their advantages wisely. Focus on yourself and not others. I consider myself fortunate and am carving out my own future by my own effort and lack of money will not be an obstacle. My grandmother escaped at age 50 as a refugee to Canada with no English and no money, she applied to McGill for a 2nd Ph.D., no English but she knew her formulae and math, she got her 2nd Ph.D. in Canada and earned her way working as a student and then doing post-doc work (her English is now excellent, altho with a heavy accent). We all make our own future, it is in our hands, we are solely responsible for what happens to us - no excuses.

 

Wow, that was a well-written and inspiring post f.d. That's a good attitude to have.

 

For the OP, my mother once said to me, focus on things that are under your control, and don't worry about things that are out of your hands. So what does this mean for you and me? Well, you've applied to med this year I presume, so you've done your part. The rest is upto God. But what can you do now? Well, you can focus on bettering yourself. Making sure that you are who YOU want to be, and being the BEST at whatever it is you're doing. If that means, being a student, then be an INTERESTED student, with curiosity, oppennes, and excitement! You're incredibly lucky to have this great opportunity to learn, so make the best of it, and at the same time, do others a good turn. Help others, in any way possible, and you'll be surprised how much others will help you when you need it the most. What goes around, comes around. Focus on what you can do, not on what's happening with others. And it all works out in the end.

[future_doc]

Orange, what you said is truly inspirational. Together with ontariostudent, we probably covered most bases.

 

And "do others a good turn", and your statement "Help others, in any way possible, and you'll be surprised how much others will help you when you need it the most. What goes around, comes around. Focus on what you can do, not on what's happening with others. And it all works out in the end." is so true.

 

[Julie]

I agree with other posters. Also, just a note on ECs & money... in my opinion, if you can get a good part-time job during school (ie TA, tutoring, RA, or tons of others), I think that can totally strengthen your application, as much as volunteering would have. (Of course you should probably do both if you have time, but it doesn't have to be fancy or expensive volunteering). They're looking for people with good experiences, not necessarily (/not usually) people who never worked.

 

My parents are definitely not rich and money was never an issue that interfered with my going to medical school. I didn't live a rich person's lifestyle, but totally got by on student loans + part time work before med school and, during med school, line of credit (which you can get without a cosigner as long as your credit is good). If you're determined to become a doctor in Canada, I don't think your parent's income should stop you in any way.

[Prothrombin]

First of all, if you want to practice in Canada, don't worry about schools in the UK or the Caribbean. While it's possible to go to school there and practice here, it's definitely not the preferred route (meaning there's no guarantee that you'll be able to come back and practice here). American schools are safer options, but yes they are expensive and it will still be harder for you to come back.

 

Canadian schools are quite affordable. The Ontario schools (which tend to be the most expensive in Canada) are about 20k each year but if you qualify for loans (which it sounds like you would), finances should not hold you back at all, especially because if you're in a Canadian school you probably don't need a cosigner for a bank line of credit (though every bank is different and you'll have to shop around to find what you're looking for).

 

The bottom line is that finances should NOT hold you back from medical school in Canada. The only way I could see financial worries interfering is if you need to work full time while in school and it takes away from you having ECs or a good GPA. Yes there are some people who might be able to buy their way into medical school (I don't wish to enter into a discussion about this), it is definitely not how the average person in Canada gets an MD. Worry about yourself and you should be fine.

 

As mentioned in another thread, getting into med in some places may not be so hard, but graduating with an MD and landing a residency spot is entirely different. If the people you mentioned truly aren't qualified, they won't finish as doctors. If they are, you really shouldn't spend your time worrying about how fair it is that they are in medical school.

 

I agree with everything you say, except I think that going to an American MD school is a very feasible route should one wish to practice in Canada. The equivalency tests aren't that hard if you know what you're doing (which you should).

[thatonekid]

If you're determined to become a doctor in Canada, I don't think your parent's income should stop you in any way.

Quoted for truth.

[Octavius]

I feel ya, I've seen rich kids dodge the GPA cut offs by going to international diploma mills but there's no point in envy or jealousy - it won't change the situation nor is it any of your business what others do. The only thing that is relevant is your own personal actions. I grew up very poor as well (parents were refugees that still can't speak English) so I can see the advantages my friends have over me. In Canada, even though the class is disproportionately represented by upper-middle class, it's still more meritocratic than the international diploma mills so you need not worry beyond the inherent EC bias. Just keep your GPA up, your MCAT scores up, and pack up good extra curriculars...Unfortunately I haven't been able to rack extra curriculars since I was working but I'm hoping my experiences in health care analytics and research will count for the extra-curriculars. You're right, I've seen rich families send their kids overseas on volunteer projects to bolster their application whereas a poor student will be working at a Tim Horton's to pay their tuition - one is going to look far more attractive than the other. There will always and everywhere be a socioeconomic bias. But you do what you can. Canada has been pretty good at subsidizing education and our banks have been pretty generous in extending credit towards professional school.

 

Just keep your credit up:

http://www.myfico.com/Downloads/Files/myFICO_UYFS_Booklet.pdf

 

I'd imagine your FICO score would impact your interest rates during school...

 

I always joked with my parents that the study of medicine is a rich man's game: starting with the 250 mcat fee, the mcat materials costs, my 520 dollar application, and the travel/dress for interviews LOL, the ability to forego 7 years of earnings, and the massive debt load sure to come. My parents are still poor to the extent where I had to fund all this myself where most of my friends parents cover everything up to and including overseas tuition. I think growing up poor made me more self-sufficient so I'm happy I had that experience oddly enough.

 

Good luck!

[future_doc]

Making responsible choices in education, activities and time management skills is definitely character building just as is being required to build your own future from self-sacrifice and hard work.

 

Having everything handed to you on a silver platter gives one a false snese of entitlement and reality which really places such people behind the 8 ball in the long run. When push comes to shove and serious life problems occur, they won't have the internal resources, motivation or skills to deal with them; and their parents are doing them no favour by not properly preparing them for life. I have seen more than one family lose their entire fortune (recent stock market crash and recession causing private company failures are an example) and kids form such families don't know how to handle what for the rest of us is just everyday life. That is why Bill Gates will give most of his fortune to oworthy causes and not his kids.

[Octavius]

Making responsible choices in education, activities and time management skills is definitely character building just as is being required to build your own future from self-sacrifice and hard work.

 

Having everything handed to you on a silver platter gives one a false snese of entitlement and reality which really places such people behind the 8 ball in the long run. When push comes to shove and serious life problems occur, they won't have the internal resources, motivation or skills to deal with them; and their parents are doing them no favour by not properly preparing them for life. I have seen more than one family lose their entire fortune (recent stock market crash and recession causing private company failures are an example) and kids form such families don't know how to handle what for the rest of us is just everyday life. That is why Bill Gates will give most of his fortune to oworthy causes and not his kids.

Exactly. I have nothing against rich people or their kids. The way I think, is that the majority of people who are wealthy earned it for a reason, if they didn't deserve the wealth, it would evaporate quickly because even the preservation of wealth can be difficult for people who aren't trained (see lottery winners/celebrities). If they are wealthy and want to support their kids, it's their right and their choice but it may strip some valuable lessons (hopefully they will learn these lessons at some point, sooner rather than later).

 

Where I work now, most people are making large incomes on average but many hold nothing or are even in debt. A situation of growing up poor let's you evaluate what a need and a want is, and how to keep your financial ratios on track. Heck, a lot of people who become doctors will lose a ton of money via bad investments or just living the lavish lifestyle and end up paying debt the rest of their life...I don't know, it mystifies me sometimes that people would willingly accept debt at 20% interest levels. So growing up poor and building up definitely has its merits.

 

Hmm story from personal experience, I grew up in a very poor area with high crime and dropout rates. I was able to dodge the civil service imposed segregation by using the French Immersion program to jump to a middle-upper class school. Many of the students here just partied, they knew nothing outside of a life of leisure. They worked retail and had their parents pay off their entire tuition for programs of no market values since they felt they had to be in university. They didn't take their education seriously, they didn't work hard, and they're working retail every summer to pay for their booze. When they graduate, they have low paying mediocre jobs with a near useless degree with crap gpa with no direction. My best friend (who comes from money) gave me an awesome quote:

"The grandfather builds the empire, the son continues it, and the grand children destroy it". Of course there are many exceptions (my friend being one of them). But having things on a silver platter causes you to bypass many important lessons in life such as savings and responsibility, and strategic planning. It's up to the parents to teach it, or the child to take the initiative to learn. For those of us who were poor, we had to sink or swim - we didn't have much of a choice. Granted those that sank, the future isn't pretty. I saw some of my elementary/middle school kids on FB, some of them have kids with no university degree or earning power.

[future_doc]

Yes, I've heard of the three generation rule whereby the 3rd generation could be on welfare, from riches to rages so to speak.

 

Immigrants, refugees for sure, come ot Canada with the clothing on their backs and nothing else. They have nowhere else to go but up, know about struggling and generally speaking, become valuable contributors to society. Rich kids are born with a serious handicap.

[future_doc]

You are right. Coming from money is not necessarily a disadvanatge, it depends upon the individual. I have wealthy friends and some are aimless precisely b/c they don't have any motivation due to their sense of entitlement. However, others strive for their own success.

 

And yes, our success depends strictly upon ourselves, no argument there.

[Octavius]

This is a ridiculous generalization.

 

Come on people, having rich parents is not nearly as influential as people like to think. Kids of rich parents can have sh!tty lives too.

Get over it.

 

Everyone has some advantage and some disadvantage over someone else.

Who cares! People use what they've got to get what they want. Some people more ethically than others, but in the end, that's just the way it is.

 

Seriously, some other kid's family has no impact on whether or not you succeed, so don't even bother giving it any thought.

No disagreement there. Just elaboring on what I've personally noticed/seen. What others do is none of my business unless bribery was a strict pre-req...in which case I wouldn't be living in this country lol. There will always and everywhere a socioeconomic bias - wealth is a claim on production and our markets will function to serve the highest bidder for a good/service assuming no barrier to entry. That's the way the world rolls - although med school admissions has GPA + MCAT as a barrier to entry. I'm happy with the admissions system in Canada, besides the supply-demand miscoordination.

[Wolvenstar]

Lol, I really have to laugh at all the people talked about how comming from wealth leaves kids with these serious handicapps. Yet the statistics show that a higher percentage of kids from private schools (high school) graduate and attend some form of post-secondary education that those in public schools. Attendance at private schools is also correlated with family wealth.

 

In comparing public school statistics, children from families that have recently immigrated (either the child and parents immigrated, or the parents did and the child was born in Canada) have a higher rate of attendance in post-secondary education than those that have not recently immigrated.

 

Now tie this together with many people's experiences of the spoiled rich kids, and theories that show a family can go from riches to rags in three generations.

 

You should see two major variables in this; Money and Parenting.

 

Many people who don't come from wealthy families tend to get hung up on the fact that these kids come from money and that money must somehow run their life (either making or breaking it).

 

The truth is that money can confer an advantage to a person. This makes sense as it can provide an individual with many benefits.

 

However money is an inanimate object, it doesn't have a bias, that depends on how it is used. What makes or breaks you is your parents, and what you learn from them. Why do so many kids comming from money end up screwing it up in life? Because their parents did a crappy job of raising them. Their parents have been influencing their thoughts, beliefs, perceptions, and overall personality since they were toddlers. Now money might give parents a little more leeway in that it won't be until later on that one sees their child being screwed up because the family wealth buffered them for a time, but it is still how good or bad your parents raised you that has the major impact on life.

 

 

In so many areas of life I see people looking for dozens of reasons to explain why people do things but completely ignore and overlook those adults who had a chance to make an impact in that individual's life. I am so tired of people not being willing to take the blame, or place the blame on people.

 

This is why recently children of immigrated families have higher rate of attending post-secondary education, because of their parents. It is not the struggling against poverty, makes these individuals go to post-secondary school it was the family beliefs, and values, and the way their parents raised them.

 

 

In many ways money can give you an advantage that will put you ahead of the game. In so many more ways having experienced poor parenting and not learning the correct lessons from it can cripple you.

 

(I say not learning the correct lessons, because some children raised with poor parenting practices do make it somewhere in life, because they learned the right lessons from the poor parenting, the ones that are harder to learn and less likely to be learned)

 

In all honest truth if we had more money we would have the opportunity to focus more on school and have more free time for ECs and not have to work part-time (or at least work as much). There is an increased probability that we would be able to afford a better quality of diet, and engage in more activities that would contribute to our well-roundedness.

[w8kg6]

Rich kids are born with a serious handicap.

 

This was a pretty dumb thing to say. It's a common conception that by the time the third generation rolls around, a sense of entitlement and snobbishness has made its way into the 'genes' of a family, but I would say that this is a common misconception. How can you possibly argue that being rich is a disadvantage and being an immigrant coming here in poverty with nowhere to go but up is advantageous? Also, the traits that make a first generation rich will more than likely be instilled in the first generation's children, which will then be instilled in the third. It makes sense that a child learns what he lives, and the statement "like father like son" is very sensible. Also, poverty is a cycle, and with so few opportunities available to refugees or members of the extreme poor, I can't imagine how a supposedly learned person can argue that a poor person has an advantage over a rich person, who likely comes from a family with traits that encourage their wealth, and have every door open to them.

 

Seriously, where was the logic in that thinking?

 

 

 

 

To answer the original question, there is definitely a positive correlation between a family's socioeconomic status and the ability to get into med school. This isn't because of the ability to 'buy seats', however. If you've got money, you can do more things. As a youth, you will be able to take part in the extracurricular activities that will encourage social development. As an adolescent, you won't be expected to have a job so you can help the family pay the bills, and this will mean that as a rich child, it will be easier to excel academically and in your extracurriculars. In university, you won't be under the financial stress of poorer students, and ultimately, your parents will be able to pay for your med schools applications (which, lets be honest, can get unreasonably expensive once flights and hotels are factored in).

 

Do rich parents = med school? To an extent, but not because of the ability to 'buy seats'.

[sfinch]

In general, IQ has been strongly associated with success, wealth, and low criminality (though not always!!!). There is also some association with IQ and genetics - though nuture is important too. I'd wager once basic needs and opportunities are made availaible...as they are to most (but not all) people in 1st world nations, and barring blatant discrimination...one's final adult intelligence is probably most related to their genetics. Identical twin adoption studies are one of the most remarkable things to push this, but even simple siblings as well. Steve Jobs is a great example (adopted by high school dropouts, the man became super successful...as an adult finds his full biological sister is one of America's most prominent and successful writers (and his biological parents successful academics)).

 

Being born to rich parents means obviously good access to opportunities. But it also may mean a slightly higher chance of being born with intelligence and behavioural tendencies that may lead to success anyways. Upper classes tend to remain upper classes generation after generaion in most countries. This does not include immigration - which is a different phenomenom entirely.

[future_doc]

This was a pretty dumb thing to say. It's a common conception that by the time the third generation rolls around, a sense of entitlement and snobbishness has made its way into the 'genes' of a family, but I would say that this is a common misconception. How can you possibly argue that being rich is a disadvantage and being an immigrant coming here in poverty with nowhere to go but up is advantageous? Also, the traits that make a first generation rich will more than likely be instilled in the first generation's children, which will then be instilled in the third. It makes sense that a child learns what he lives, and the statement "like father like son" is very sensible. Also, poverty is a cycle, and with so few opportunities available to refugees or members of the extreme poor, I can't imagine how a supposedly learned person can argue that a poor person has an advantage over a rich person, who likely comes from a family with traits that encourage their wealth, and have every door open to them.

 

Seriously, where was the logic in that thinking?

 

As a young child together with my sister, my mother brought us to Canada as refugees. No money. My mother found jobs as filing clerk to give us shelter and food. She had a university degree and a profession, it took a long time for her to secure a proper job and then the bottom fell out in her field and she was unemployed with nothing but bills. She got student loans, raised 2 children, took on many part time jobs, did a 4 yr university program in 3 years while supporting a family. She is thriving in a different profession. Not once in Canada did I feel poor or starving. Yes, I always wore hand-me-downs, the kids made fun of my clothes and my accent. These same kids are my buddies today. I learned compassion to others from being picked on. I appreciate Canada, my opportunities and am so grateful. My so-called povery (that I never felt) and difficulties allowed me to appreciate the small things in life. I worked summers and all holidays and found employment that paid me according to results, I was in sales and did very well. I have recieved an excellent education, speak 4 languages, difficult circumstances build character, you learn to make responsible choices with no frills living. The glass is completely full. Coming from financial wealth or upper class can be an advanteous sometimes and this is great. I also see the other side with friends from wealthy families. I am better off than those friends who feel a sense of entitlement for sure, I am securing my own future, some of my friends are wasting their youth and educational opportunities. My sister put herself thru law school working fulltime as a waitress, 40 hours/week while attending school. She is now studying for her 2nd law degree and next year will go for her Masters. Yes, she has student loans, she works whenever she can and her time and money is very budgeted. My grandmother too came as a refugee with $10 and no English. She cleaned bedpans et al of the wealthy patients and was glad to do it. She had no money, no English, needed food and shelter and her only asset was her PhD. Her language was the international language of math and physics, so she studied for another PhD with no English, she worked as a 50 + yr old student, taught graduate students learning Enlgish along the way, lol, and did post-doctoral research until retirement. Our financial poverty, our will, drive, need and desire to better ourselves and obtain the best possible education in Canada made my entire family successful. We are also happy.

 

Yes, I admit that I am dumb. But not b/c of what you say, I am the dumbest and least educated in my family. I don't yet have one degree, all lthe others have multi-degrees except for my sister who will have 2 degrees in May and in May 2011, she shall have three degrees. Poverty has been a blessing indeed. Oh, the community gave me the best possible subsidized education at an expensive private school we could never afford. Canada is wonderful. I will give the same opportunities to my children and be happy to pay for it. Having received a subsidized education, my sister and I being the only students who were not from wealthy families, I intend to give back when I am a doc. I am both dumb and fortunate and would not change my circumstances for anything. Lack of financial resources helped to shape me into the person I have become.

 

Perception is reality. Your perception and mine are different. May we both achieve our full potential and our dreams!

[The_B]

Money matters. Higher Socio-economic status begets higher socio-economic status. Sure there are an infinite number of factors that come into play when determining whether or not someone will be successful, but on average, those from well to do backgrounds have a better chance of "making it".

 

Better schools in better neighborhoods. Broader exposures to ones world for education. Opportunity to use ones time to expose themselves to other things instead of work. More hobbies (music, sports). Heck, even the ease of going to school in nicer quality clothes can impact ones development. Alone, these are small things, but added together, and of course those from families with better means will have a leg up.

 

Of course those from less well to do backgrounds can do great, and those from rich parents can fall flat on their faces. At the end of the day, we are individuals and can make or break ourselves. But NEVER underestimate the effect of what gives us the tools to get us where we are. We are the products of our upbringing. And if success and happiness is all you have ever known, odds are you will continue to see it. If the opposite is true, odds are again, you will continue down that path. Sometimes it isn't money that is instilled into us, but the ideas of hard work and enjoying what you do. But often, hard work leads to money.

 

Overall, I think that as a product of our past, we gain the gifts given to us. Generally speaking (and of course there will be lots of exceptions) if those who raised us to do well, we will. So, on average, if one comes from money, they are more inclined to succeed.

[rmorelan]

Money matters. Higher Socio-economic status begets higher socio-economic status. Sure there are an infinite number of factors that come into play when determining whether or not someone will be successful, but on average, those from well to do backgrounds have a better chance of "making it".

 

Better schools in better neighborhoods. Broader exposures to ones world for education. Opportunity to use ones time to expose themselves to other things instead of work. More hobbies (music, sports). Heck, even the ease of going to school in nicer quality clothes can impact ones development. Alone, these are small things, but added together, and of course those from families with better means will have a leg up.

 

Sounds called accumulative advantage - a small edge edge early on causes a slight increase in skill which causes the person to stand out and have additional opportunities to advance. Wealth I suppose can get the ball rolling.

[AndreaM]

Having taken a course recently about the psychology of human resilience I have read quite a few research papers about how SES affects positive outcomes and generally the higher your SES the greater proportion of positive outcomes among a group. Low SES is a generally accepted risk factor for children, which as was stated above can be buffered by personal, family and community factors, such as high IQ, high parental monitoring and a variety of community programs such as extra-curricular activity involvement.

[Sim]

If more rich people are accepted in medicine, for sure that doesn't mean they have better chances of making it in medicine.

 

These " rich " people have been raised by successful parents. They might have siblings or family who are high-achievers as well, making some of these people, since childhood, more willing to make it in a profession such medicine. They're not more intelligent, and they don't have better chances in their application. It's obviously not a factor. It's all about marks and interviews.

 

Higher Socio-economic status begets higher socio-economic status.

 

Yes, but for acceptance in canadian universities, they don't have any advantage.

 

I have a part-time job as most people, and I don't feel like this situation is unfair at all.

 

Having taken a course recently about the psychology of human resilience I have read quite a few research papers about how SES affects positive outcomes [...]

 

I'm sceptic about the research you've read, as I've seen in school that intelligence is pure biology, and therefore cannot be controled in any way after-birth (only a negligible fraction can). Two very intelligent parents won't necessary make an intelligent children, since the only way to have more intelligent children is with an evolution of the entire nation in a very long period (and not only in one generation); thanks to Darwin.

[AndreaM]

I'm sceptic about the research you've read, as I've seen in school that intelligence is pure biology, and therefore cannot be controled in any way after-birth (only a negligible fraction can). Two very intelligent parents won't necessary make an intelligent children, since the only way to have more intelligent children is with an evolution of the entire nation in a very long period (and not only in one generation); thanks to Darwin.

 

Much of resilience research is corrolational in nature, due to ethical issues, so causation is difficult to assess, but low SES has been shown to be highly correlated with less positive outcomes and is a well accepted risk factor for children. I was not saying that IQ wasn't genetic, I was saying that having a high IQ can buffer the risks associated with low SES.

 

Take future_doc for example. It is likely, based on the high degree of post-secondary success in her family, that the members of her family have higher than average IQ and therefore had a much greater chance of success than others with a similar SES, but lower IQ. Future_doc also mentioned other factors, such as social programs and a strong parental role model that allowed her to succeed despite high risk.

 

Being rich won't make you succeed, and being poor won't stop you from succeeding, but having a higher SES has been statistically correlated with greater success in the long term.

[AndreaM]

I also wanted to add that I come from a thoroughly middle class background. My mom is a teacher and my dad is an elementary school principal. I grew up in a smaller community, in a good neighborhood, and went to public school. With 3 siblings there wasn't any room in the budget for world travel or expensive hobbies, but I did have the opportunity participate in music and drama through school and had private music lessons.

 

I don't think being middle class has held me back, but I do think that school would have been easier if I hadn't needed to work part-time during my studies. I could have had more time for EC's, if my parents could have paid for my education, but at the same time I was very movtivated to succeed, because it was my own hard-earned money that was paying for my education.

[rmorelan]

The joys of psychology The research goes back and forth a bit but generally speaking intelligence appears to be a roughly even mix of genetic and environmental factors. Genetics of course is the raw building blocks but in terms of the environment people often forget about how simple things like nutrition and prenatal care play a huge role and are closely related to SES. The human brain also has critical periods where it is highly receptive to particular types of simulation and and higher SES can help in that regard.