McMaster Health Science

[bling]

I also would not say that Mac Health Sci is more medicine-like than Med Sci. Instead, I would say that medical science focusses on the scientific basis for biological and pathological processes. Mac health sci, on the other hand, focusses on problems present in the health care field. They're both things that are important in medicine, but some people would probably rather learn advanced biochemistry, where as others may want to learn about health promotion, health policy development, etc.

 

mac health sci absolutely does not "focus" on problems present in the health care field. we have 1 required course on heath systems and health policy in third year. it's definitely a rigorous and fascinating course, but as i mentioned previously students in health sci consistently take courses such as pathophysiology, pathoanatomy, virology, immunology, biochemistry, etc. the program would therefore be better described as "holistic", offering courses that span a broad range of health/science-related topics.

 

i'm not bashing western med sci or any other program, so please don't think that. it would be silly to comment on a program that i don't have first-hand experience with; i think that would be best left to the students who are actually in that program.

[cling]

Enroll to Mac HealthSci, it is your best shot at becoming a doctor. Half the class gets into medicine. No other program in Canada comes close. Be prepared for people calling your program a backdoor to medschool or the like

[ChicoMaki]

If you want some more info. PM me. I have some interesting insight that I'd rather not share on this forum because of privacy/personal issues (i.e people may know me from the info I disclose).

[lost__in__space]

Go to Mac Health Sci for all the reasons stated (enormous GPA inflation, feeder program into Mac Meds, easy to do well). I sure wish I had gotten in... because Western Health Sci sucks!

[deeman101]

bling and cling, are you like related? Or are your names just randomly very similar?

[The Law]

admissions/decisions

bling/cling

 

It never ends with this thread!

[tree999]

Go to Mac Health Sci for all the reasons stated (enormous GPA inflation, feeder program into Mac Meds, easy to do well). I sure wish I had gotten in... because Western Health Sci sucks!

The fact that a sizable proportion of Mac Health Sci grads get into med school does not mean that this program is "your best shot at becoming a doctor". That's poor logic. Does Mac Health Sci increase your chance of getting into med? Or do students who want to go to med choose Health Sci? Come on. Students who have an interest in health sciences/medicine at the end of high school choose this program. And then they do well. Because a) they did well in high school, or they know they need good marks to get into med, or c) they are interested in the courses they take and actually enjoy learning the material. If you're only interested in getting good grades for med school, you have lots of options. And if that's your main concern, you could probably find an easier program than one filled with smart, hardworking premeds.

[The Law]

The fact that a sizable proportion of Mac Health Sci grads get into med school does not mean that this program is "your best shot at becoming a doctor". That's poor logic. Does Mac Health Sci increase your chance of getting into med? Or do students who want to go to med choose Health Sci? Come on. Students who have an interest in health sciences/medicine at the end of high school choose this program. And then they do well. Because a) they did well in high school, or they know they need good marks to get into med, or c) they are interested in the courses they take and actually enjoy learning the material. If you're only interested in getting good grades for med school, you have lots of options. And if that's your main concern, you could probably find an easier program than one filled with smart, hardworking premeds.

 

I love how so many HS students act as though they are God's gift to the world of premed. Geez, give me a break. There are smart, hardworking premeds in other programs too. None of these programs really let you mark yourself though, or defer exams for no reason, or discuss with your prof to determine your mark (or get marks for things you haven't completed yet)! I don't mean to offend health sci grads and students, but please don't act like the people in your program are somewhat superior to people in other programs.

[tree999]

I love how so many HS students act as though they are God's gift to the world of premed. Geez, give me a break. There are smart, hardworking premeds in other programs too. None of these programs really let you mark yourself though, or defer exams for no reason, or discuss with your prof to determine your mark (or get marks for things you haven't completed yet)! I don't mean to offend health sci grads and students, but please don't act like the people in your program are somewhat superior to people in other programs.

Dude, I didn't go to Mac. I don't think Mac students or any health sci students are superior. For the record, I was in another health science program and none of that self-marking/exam-deferring crap was going down. I just wanted to point out a) the logical fallacy and the fact that there are other options if your ultimate goal is just getting into med. Obviously there are smart, hardworking premeds (or non premeds) everywhere! But you can definitely find a program with a smaller concentration of keeners. Do you really disagree with that?

[The Law]

Dude, I didn't go to Mac. I don't think Mac students or any health sci students are superior. For the record, I was in another health science program and none of that self-marking/exam-deferring crap was going down. I just wanted to point out a) the logical fallacy and the fact that there are other options if your ultimate goal is just getting into med. Obviously there are smart, hardworking premeds (or non premeds) everywhere! But you can definitely find a program with a smaller concentration of keeners. Do you really disagree with that?

 

Fair enough, but I don't really think it's a logically fallacy when you consider the numerous factors that account for the high acceptance proportion in that program. I really don't think that the reason why Mac health sci grads get in is due to intrinsic property of the applicant pool because the external factors affecting marks are also really large. Sorry I seemed to come down on you in my previous post, I just have had experiences with some Mac HS students who acted as though people in their program are better than people in other programs.

[lost__in__space]

The fact that a sizable proportion of Mac Health Sci grads get into med school does not mean that this program is "your best shot at becoming a doctor". That's poor logic. Does Mac Health Sci increase your chance of getting into med? Or do students who want to go to med choose Health Sci? Come on. Students who have an interest in health sciences/medicine at the end of high school choose this program. And then they do well. Because a) they did well in high school, or they know they need good marks to get into med, or c) they are interested in the courses they take and actually enjoy learning the material. If you're only interested in getting good grades for med school, you have lots of options. And if that's your main concern, you could probably find an easier program than one filled with smart, hardworking premeds.

 

I never said it's the best shot at becoming a doctor, so I don't know where those quotation marks are coming from, but you have to admit, that as Law says, in a program where in some courses you can defer exams, or mark yourself, or get your grade bumped up if you ask, you're sure to have a higher GPA, thus a better chance at med school. I don't disagree that they do have a higher grade entrance from high school or that premeds probably tend to self select for this program, but I am arguing that 1. the grading policies of the program are enormously beneficial to getting that coveted GPA and can be seen as unfair when compared to other programs 2. the atmosphere of "premediness" that probably pervades the program will help one achieve high marks and get ECs in because if all your friends are doing it (and they know what ad coms are looking for) then you probably will too.

 

I personally find it extremely funny that a program has 1/2 students gaining admission to meds post grad. Everyone in my first year health sciences (UWO) courses put up their hands when asked "who wants to go into meds?" but the fact of the matter is that all the people left by 4th year who still want to go are the only ones who actually have the average, everyone else failed out or has ****ty averages and won't make the cutoff, so they had to apply to something else, something that is less likely at Mac health sci to happen because of high GPA averages.

[cling]

I don't disagree that they do have a higher grade entrance from high school or that premeds probably tend to self select for this program, but I am arguing that 1. the grading policies of the program are enormously beneficial to getting that coveted GPA and can be seen as unfair when compared to other programs

 

Seconded .

[tree999]

I never said it's the best shot at becoming a doctor, so I don't know where those quotation marks are coming from, but you have to admit, that as Law says, in a program where in some courses you can defer exams, or mark yourself, or get your grade bumped up if you ask, you're sure to have a higher GPA, thus a better chance at med school. I don't disagree that they do have a higher grade entrance from high school or that premeds probably tend to self select for this program, but I am arguing that 1. the grading policies of the program are enormously beneficial to getting that coveted GPA and can be seen as unfair when compared to other programs 2. the atmosphere of "premediness" that probably pervades the program will help one achieve high marks and get ECs in because if all your friends are doing it (and they know what ad coms are looking for) then you probably will too.

 

I personally find it extremely funny that a program has 1/2 students gaining admission to meds post grad. Everyone in my first year health sciences (UWO) courses put up their hands when asked "who wants to go into meds?" but the fact of the matter is that all the people left by 4th year who still want to go are the only ones who actually have the average, everyone else failed out or has ****ty averages and won't make the cutoff, so they had to apply to something else, something that is less likely at Mac health sci to happen because of high GPA averages.

sorry buddy, that was a quote by cling from earlier. I just don't know how to double quote -- I'm not good at the internet!

 

did someone from Mac actually confirm that this "flexible" grading/testing system goes on in Health Sci? (just trying to be optimistic about the integrity of the program)

 

but lost_in_space, it's also true that students in these wide-ranging health science programs actually WANT to do other careers. it's also good preparation for hospital administration, public health, or health policy. a lot of students from my program chose to do grad work in epidemiology or health promotion because they discovered they were more interested in it. it's not always that they're failing out!

[bnface]

I've heard very few med students who know health sci grads criticize the hth sci program. It just seems that there is a bit of a power-/class-type struggle among the premed community.

 

I've heard very few Program Directors/Physicians involved in academic medicine criticize the Mac Med program. However, again, among the medical student community, many students often look down at the pedagogical approach.

 

These class-type struggles are inevitable. When we all become doctors (cross fingers), people will complain how "easy" it is for us to make money and maintain a decent lifestyle. Again, an argument made by outsiders. All that matters is that people who make the big decisions (government and policymakers in the latter case, medical school admissions and program directors in the former cases) are better-informed.

[Microbiodude]

don't be fooled, mac health sci is an extremely rigorous program, especially from 2nd - 4th year. in second year you will have a packed schedule courses like anatomy/physiology, cell biology, epidemiology and biostatistics. you will have numerous group projects in addition to studying for midterms/exams individually. in 3rd and 4th year there are fewer required courses but people in the program often take very science-intensive courses like virology, immuno, advance immuno, and biochemistry IN ADDITION to the less-sciency (but more medicine-y) courses like critical appraisal and health policy.

 

all that being said, the program really will help prepare you for a career in medicine.. you will come out of it as a collaborative, inquisitive team player instead of a cutthroat "i memorize facts and regurgitate" student (not to say that the other programs you cited would produce this!)

 

Don't worry about the "very science-intensive" courses...as someone who is in science and has taken these courses...I can assure you they are not that intense. They cover the knowledge in depth but not enough to overload you. It's actually quite nice, it gives you a nice introduction to these topics without trying to prepare you to conduct viral or immunological research. Also, these were optional as was mentioned, so you're more than welcome to opt out of these "intensive" courses.

[princess19]

people who are not in health sci seem to love bashing it based on rumours & heresay. unfortunately, this large number of haters does not help someone who is trying to make a very difficult decision about where to go for undergrad. as a graduate of the program, please PM me if you have any questions or would like to know more about the curriculum/what to expect. i remember being in your shoes as i had a very tough choice to make between mac health sci and mac arts & sciences, and in the end i couldn't have been happier with my decision. that is not to say health sci will be right for you, but if you're looking for specific info about this program from someone who ACTUALLY went through it, i would be more than happy to help. i don't feel like posting anything publically about my experience as it will inevitably turn into another huge debate with people who are resentful of the program...sigh.

[aani]

I'm in health sci right now....pm me if you have any questions!

 

Note: you do not just get a mark because you want it and ask for it. You will get a bad mark if you don't put in the effort, and you will do good if you do. Just like at any other program...so that shouldn't be the basis for anyone's acceptance

[Meade]

did anyone actually go to mac health sci? seems that a lot of the negative comments are heresay.

 

Hey etoilex,

 

I actually know someone who rejected his offer for Mac's Health Science program and he had a high school average of 99%. Ridiculous, I know. Now he's going to Brock University - but I think he's a retard. That's just me.

 

If I were in your shoes, I'd definitely go for it, it will inflate your GPA immensely and help you make connections throughout your undergrad.

 

Good luck on your decision!

[sbrugby]

Hey etoilex,

 

I actually know someone who rejected his offer for Mac's Health Science program and he had a high school average of 99%. Ridiculous, I know. Now he's going to Brock University - but I think he's a retard. That's just me.

 

If I were in your shoes, I'd definitely go for it, it will inflate your GPA immensely and help you make connections throughout your undergrad.

 

Good luck on your decision!

 

Why is that so ridiculous?

 

I chose York University over Mac Health Sciences and I've been very happy with my decision. I'm sure Health Sci is a fantastic program and have lots of friends who are happy there, it just wasn't the best decision at the time for me.

 

Just because people think differently and have varying preferences doesn't mean their decisions are "retarded" or w/e.

[n00b]

but brock? why

[ShootingStar]

I'm rejecting Mac Health Science for McGill Life Science this upcoming September as well...

 

I think it's all a matter of personal interest.

 

My reasons:

 

1. You just can't beat the metropolitan city of Montreal (VS Hamilton..) I feel that the people I'll meet and my experiences there the next four years is something that Mac healthsci cannot offer (Of course, this can be said for any university)

 

2. I'm more of a structured learner

 

3. I truly do not believe that I would be at any "premed advantage" going into McMaster HealthSci, or any other university for that matter.

 

4. I know some people who are for sure going into that program, and I really dislike the whole "I'm-in-mac-healthsci-so-i'm-better-than-you" attitude that they give off (Of course, this is probably only a selected few)

 

But overall, I hear that it's an amazing program, so go if you like the university and if the learning style works for you. But I don't think you should go if you're only going because you think that it's "the only way to get into med school"... I honestly believe it's what you make of it, and not where you go. But who knows, I'm just a naive highschooler myself

[The Law]

people who are not in health sci seem to love bashing it based on rumours & heresay. unfortunately, this large number of haters does not help someone who is trying to make a very difficult decision about where to go for undergrad. as a graduate of the program, please PM me if you have any questions or would like to know more about the curriculum/what to expect.

 

Well, we can't bash it on personal experience if we are not in it - we can only base it on what people in the program tell us. My friends who are in the program have told me numerous instances where it is apparent that Mac HS grads basically have a free ride. I mean, just a few days ago they told me that this year, one of the profs gave an A+ to almost everyone in the class because she didn't want to mark every single person and did it based on whether they handed in their work or not. I keep hearing so many sketchy things from the ppl in that program.

[cling]

Well, we can't bash it on personal experience if we are not in it - we can only base it on what people in the program tell us. My friends who are in the program have told me numerous instances where it is apparent that Mac HS grads basically have a free ride. I mean, just a few days ago they told me that this year, one of the profs gave an A+ to almost everyone in the class because she didn't want to mark every single person and did it based on whether they handed in their work or not. I keep hearing so many sketchy things from the ppl in that program.

 

Law, be careful... anything you say questioning the academic intensity of Mac Health Sci, you risk getting called a loser with no life. It is their most effective way of rebutting your statement.

[princess19]

Law, be careful... anything you say questioning the academic intensity of Mac Health Sci, you risk getting called a loser with no life. It is their most effective way of rebutting your statement.

 

more troubling than questioning the academic "intensity" of the program is the tendency to question the integrity of the program. i don't know who your "friends" in the program are but i can assure you that professors do not hand out A+ because they don't feel like marking individual assignments, and i can imagine they would not like to be degraded in this way on a public forum by some bitter student who is not even in the program.

 

as for cling, your sweeping statement about all health sci students is pathetic, untrue but completely unsurprising coming from you. you really should get your perceptions of health sci students in check if you plan on entering medicine as you will be working with a LOT of them if you indeed get in.

[medaholic]

I'm rejecting Mac Health Science for McGill Life Science this upcoming September as well...

 

I think it's all a matter of personal interest.

 

My reasons:

 

1. You just can't beat the metropolitan city of Montreal (VS Hamilton..) I feel that the people I'll meet and my experiences there the next four years is something that Mac healthsci cannot offer (Of course, this can be said for any university)

 

2. I'm more of a structured learner

 

3. I truly do not believe that I would be at any "premed advantage" going into McMaster HealthSci, or any other university for that matter.

 

4. I know some people who are for sure going into that program, and I really dislike the whole "I'm-in-mac-healthsci-so-i'm-better-than-you" attitude that they give off (Of course, this is probably only a selected few)

 

But overall, I hear that it's an amazing program, so go if you like the university and if the learning style works for you. But I don't think you should go if you're only going because you think that it's "the only way to get into med school"... I honestly believe it's what you make of it, and not where you go. But who knows, I'm just a naive highschooler myself

 

You hit all the key points on why someone would choose NOT to go to a specific program because of it's reputation. Undergrad is so much more than just a stepping stone to medical school.