Nathan Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 I'm out to test the liberality of our future doctors. How would you feel if you had a companion in either medical school or in your professional career who was a rather heavy drinker and a pot smoker? Professionally, they (he/she for the grammar kids) did as good of a job in whichever area as would be expected of them. Essentially, would you care if your buddy in the next door office listened to Pink Floyd and Sublime during their time off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mourning Cloak Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 I'm out to test the liberality of our future doctors. How would you feel if you had a companion in either medical school or in your professional career who was a rather heavy drinker and a pot smoker? Professionally, they (he/she for the grammar kids) did as good of a job in whichever area as would be expected of them. Essentially, would you care if your buddy in the next door office listened to Pink Floyd and Sublime during their time off? http://rcpsc.medical.org/bioethics/cases/case_3_1_3_e.php "When physicians abuse alcohol and/or drugs, serious harms are likely. Patient health, recovery and safety are at risk. Colleagues’ own work and relationships with the physician are compromised. Physicians’ family and personal responsibilities are damaged. Their employment and career are threatened. Furthermore, morbidity and mortality risks for physicians increase significantly, especially if opioids are being abused. They are at greater risk of physical problems, suicide or death by overdose." "While there is no legal obligation in Canada for a physician to report an impaired colleague, there may be institutional requirements. Moreover, there are ethical reasons to address signs that a physician may have a substance-use problem and to carefully determine an effective and respectful way to help an impaired colleague. Every physician has legal and ethical duties to practice unimpaired. If a physician develops a substance-use problem, he/she must seek out and participate in therapy and subsequent monitoring so as to resume high-quality and safe treatment of his/her patients." You're a med student - you don't need a form an opinion! The Royal College will provide your opinion to you, for a no-so-nominal fee. (I jest, but in all seriousness, there is typically a "right" answer provided for you by the College - just ask). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psychoswim Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 What do Pink Floyd and Sublime have to do in this again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor_Strangelove Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 What do Pink Floyd and Sublime have to do in this again? I guess only pot heads listen to pink floyd is what he is implying... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psychoswim Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 I guess only pot heads listen to pink floyd is what he is implying... Yeah I got that... so I guess I'm a pothead and alcooholic.. ookay! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaronjw Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 Yeah I got that... so I guess I'm a pothead and alcooholic.. ookay! rock on girl! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmorelan Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 generally the college makes the point that the situation is very likely to escalate into a full blown serious problem, and at that point if his/her condition contributes in any way to the harm or potential harm of a patient you are legally/ethically on the hook for ignoring what you knew. I am don't mean in that abstract way we throw ethics around (that is an interesting theoretical point sir, blah, blah type of arm chair ethics) - I mean you screwed up and should have actually done something. You can phrase the situation so it sounds completely harmless (what exactly is your definition of heavy drinking?)- and it very well may but it is likely wise to explore things with physician in question fully to see if there is something else going on, and then act appropriately with full information. Can the physician really compartmentalize their life so easily? Does this go on? I know it does, and physicians are reported by the co workers all the time as well. People like to protect their work environments from potential issues - they have seen what happens when they don't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renin Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 If you're functional at work, I don't think it's a big deal what you do outside of work in terms of your social life. Everyone has different standards for social behaviour. If we went with my definition of "heavy drinker", then 99% of my med class would drink heavily at least some of the time! It's none of my business and they can go out and do whatever they want as long as it's not affecting their performance. Like all things in life, if you walk in drunk and vomit on a patient... you'll be hearing from multiple people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anxious_101 Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 If you're functional at work, I don't think it's a big deal what you do outside of work in terms of your social life. +1 I drink; I enjoy the occasional joint among friends; and I engage in numerous other lifestyle activities that one would not typically associate with a conservative physician - I skydive, bungee jump. But I also know when to get down to business and separate fun and play from work and priorities. So I am all for a very liberal attitude. Speaking of being liberal, I am also a dude who wears earrings, and based on a thread I posted earlier about this, it sounds like most people still find earrings on a male physician to be unprofessional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ellorie Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 "Affecting performance" can be sort of nebulous, though. Even if things look okay from the office across the hallway, there could be unseen deficits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psychoswim Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 +1 I drink; I enjoy the occasional joint among friends; and I engage in numerous other lifestyle activities that one would not typically associate with a conservative physician - I skydive, bungee jump. But I also know when to get down to business and separate fun and play from work and priorities. So I am all for a very liberal attitude. Speaking of being liberal, I am also a dude who wears earrings, and based on a thread I posted earlier about this, it sounds like most people still find earrings on a male physician to be unprofessional. I don't think skydiving or bungee jumping are really that farfetched.. after all physicians are just regular people like all of us. At least I know quite a few that have activities like that outside their jobs to unwind and have fun.. rafting, white water kayakin... Very cool!! I'm of a similar mind. As long as it does not affect your work then it's not really my place to judge or say anything. For some reason I have more trouble with physicians who smoke plain old cigarettes, dunno why. Maybe because unless you're completely isolated it affects everyone around you more? :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kkentm Posted July 17, 2011 Report Share Posted July 17, 2011 mark my words, marijuana will be legal by the time i can potentially start practising... this would be beneficial on more than one level, since it would prevent me from having to write out a ton of illegal medical marijuana prescriptions for my friends Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thatonekid Posted July 18, 2011 Report Share Posted July 18, 2011 "Affecting performance" can be sort of nebulous, though. Even if things look okay from the office across the hallway, there could be unseen deficits.Yup. It can become a slippery slope argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apache Posted July 18, 2011 Report Share Posted July 18, 2011 well, i'm fine with it if they're on vacation for a month or a week or something. but if you're doing harder drugs like coke/e/amphetamines in higher quantities on the weekend, there's no way you're not at least cognitively effected by it come monday morning. pot a doc could do on the weekends w/o having to worry about cognitive performance (which may go unseen to the untrained eye, especially if no ones monitoring performance) on weekdays as long as he's stopping by sunday afternoon and not a chronic smoker etc. only docs with pretty rigid schedules and extended 2-3 day breaks (no random call, extra shifts, etc.) could do this outside of work responsibly though, so it depends on the situation and you're right, it veers from being a black and white argument. if i thought someone was putting their patients at risk i'd report them, i don't like to get into people's personal business but you also have to look out for patient safety, and it would be pretty obvious if a guy binged on coke so much during the weekend that it was effecting his work on monday morn. Yup. It can become a slippery slope argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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