HopeToBeGreen Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 I was listening to a podcast of “White Coat, Black Art” from CBC radio today. They interviewed a doctor who told the following story from his residency. He was called to the ER to see a woman with a minor fracture. He found her very attractive. He treated her fracture and arrange for her to return to clinic for follow-up care. He then went out of his way to ensure that when she came to clinic she would see him (apparently this would not have happened necessarily). At her clinic visit he completed her treatment, discharged her from care and immediately asked her for a date rationalizing that since he was no longer treating her this was allowable. What really shocked me was that he then went on to defend his actions saying that he would consider doing the same thing again. He felt that a doctor who had a brief encounter with a patient should be allowed to date the patient after the encounter was over. He also said that he thought it might be appropriate to date family members who come to the hospital with a patient (for example a pretty daughter who brings her elderly mother to the ER). You can listen to the interview here: http://www.cbc.ca/whitecoat/episode/2011/06/30/white-coat-black-art-in-the-summer-boundaries-part-one/ The link to the podcast is at the bottom of the page and the interview is from 11:00 to 18:45. Apparently the college guidelines are clear that you can't date a current patient but are pretty vague about former patients. My personal opinion is that doctors should not date patients or former patients. I would allow that if a patient has a brief encounter with a doctor (say in the ER) then they meet again months later somewhere else then it might be okay to enter a relationship. I certainly never think it would be okay to proposition a patient or former patient at a hospital or other place where you practice. I don’t think it would be okay to date family of a current patient because of the obvious power imbalance. The other person might feel that the care of their family member depends on keeping you happy in the relationship. I’m wondering how other feel about this issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tooty Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 Definitely not cool imo. But more importantly, did she go out with him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HopeToBeGreen Posted July 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 Definitely not cool imo. But more importantly, did she go out with him? He reports that they did go out and the date was like a dream...except then he found out that she was gay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tooty Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HBP Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 I was listening to a podcast of “White Coat, Black Art” from CBC radio today. They interviewed a doctor who told the following story from his residency. He was called to the ER to see a woman with a minor fracture. He found her very attractive. He treated her fracture and arrange for her to return to clinic for follow-up care. He then went out of his way to ensure that when she came to clinic she would see him (apparently this would not have happened necessarily). At her clinic visit he completed her treatment, discharged her from care and immediately asked her for a date rationalizing that since he was no longer treating her this was allowable. What really shocked me was that he then went on to defend his actions saying that he would consider doing the same thing again. He felt that a doctor who had a brief encounter with a patient should be allowed to date the patient after the encounter was over. He also said that he thought it might be appropriate to date family members who come to the hospital with a patient (for example a pretty daughter who brings her elderly mother to the ER). You can listen to the interview here: http://www.cbc.ca/whitecoat/episode/2011/06/30/white-coat-black-art-in-the-summer-boundaries-part-one/ The link to the podcast is at the bottom of the page and the interview is from 11:00 to 18:45. Apparently the college guidelines are clear that you can't date a current patient but are pretty vague about former patients. My personal opinion is that doctors should not date patients or former patients. I would allow that if a patient has a brief encounter with a doctor (say in the ER) then they meet again months later somewhere else then it might be okay to enter a relationship. I certainly never think it would be okay to proposition a patient or former patient at a hospital or other place where you practice. I don’t think it would be okay to date family of a current patient because of the obvious power imbalance. The other person might feel that the care of their family member depends on keeping you happy in the relationship. I’m wondering how other feel about this issue. Imagine a young doctor who begins practicing in a smaller, rural town. He/she would have to end up dating his/her patients... In the past this would be a feel good story when they got married Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigars53 Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 Imagine a young doctor who begins practicing in a smaller, rural town. He/she would have to end up dating his/her patients... In the past this would be a feel good story when they got married We got to discuss a very similar case in small ethic groups. At the end of the discussion we came to the conclusion that if the doctor wanted to date the patient, he'd have to transfer her to another doctor (which there's not a whole lot in said small town) and also that it would be inappropriate to ask her out while at the hospital (in that case the small towns gives an advantage because of the high chances of a random encounter outside work). But yeah that's very touchy and you have to be very careful with those kinds of situations, especially if the patient is psychatric one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanillabear Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 He reports that they did go out and the date was like a dream...except then he found out that she was gay. See, I read it as "except then he found out that she was a guy" ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renin Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 We got to discuss a very similar case in small ethic groups. At the end of the discussion we came to the conclusion that if the doctor wanted to date the patient, he'd have to transfer her to another doctor (which there's not a whole lot in said small town) and also that it would be inappropriate to ask her out while at the hospital (in that case the small towns gives an advantage because of the high chances of a random encounter outside work). But yeah that's very touchy and you have to be very careful with those kinds of situations, especially if the patient is psychatric one. You cannot date any psychiatric patients of yours; present OR former. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kylamonkey Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 I think a lot of small town doctors would be more likely to find SOs from outside the community anyways. If they want to move in together, one of them moves to be with the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigars53 Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 You cannot date any psychiatric patients of yours; present OR former. I know, that's why I said ESPECIALLY psychiatric patients, because you'd really not want to get caught doing that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithril Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 Wait, so I can't base my life on Grey's Anatomy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimmyMax Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 You cannot date any psychiatric patients of yours; present OR former. You can read all about what happens to doctors who date their patients (psych or not) in Dialogue magazine, published monthly by the Royal College. Their stories are usually found at the back, in the "Disciplinary Proceedings" section. Definitely not where you want to find yourself, as a (soon-to-be-formerly) practicing physician! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lactic Folly Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 Slight correction: Dialogue is published by the College of Physicians and Surgeons of Ontario Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLengr Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 Actually I believe for non psych patients to official college position is that they must be former patients and that there needs to be an appropriate waiting period prior to commencing a relationship. The appropriate period depends on the nature of the doctor patient relationship. The more involved the longer required. So an ER doc who refills someone's OCP needs to wait much less than say an endocrinologist who looks after someones diabetes. Psych patients are always off limits as said before. The reason there is no black and white "never date former patients rule" is because you'd end up in situations where a very isolated rural doc could never date, and ER physicians would be getting in trouble if they dated someone they saw 10 years previously for a sprain and had no memory of treating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmorelan Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 Actually I believe for non psych patients to official college position is that they must be former patients and that there needs to be an appropriate waiting period prior to commencing a relationship. The appropriate period depends on the nature of the doctor patient relationship. The more involved the longer required. So an ER doc who refills someone's OCP needs to wait much less than say an endocrinologist who looks after someones diabetes. Psych patients are always off limits as said before. The reason there is no black and white "never date former patients rule" is because you'd end up in situations where a very isolated rural doc could never date, and ER physicians would be getting in trouble if they dated someone they saw 10 years previously for a sprain and had no memory of treating. Yeah this matches my understanding - like some one else send the only hard and fast rule is dating current or past psychiatric patients. Most of the cases where where people get in trouble actually do seem to be the psychiatric ones - probably because of the long term intimacy of patient care in those situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obi Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 This thread made me laugh. The UWO Pre-med T-shirt for last year said "Doctors Do It With Patience" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psychoswim Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 This thread made me laugh. The UWO Pre-med T-shirt for last year said "Doctors Do It With Patience" LOL!! 10 char Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MedPen Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 What do you mean I can't date my future patients? How the heck am I supposed to meet someone? Surely these rules don't apply if the patient is extremely attractive... Seriously though, in general, you don't **** where you eat. That's my rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moo Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 I once heard of a doc who was at a party and "treated" someone by re-Rxing their birth control or some other benign drug. Ten years later they hooked up and he got in trouble afterward because he had established an official patient-doctor relationship and dated her, even 10 years after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithril Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 So where are these guidelines? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renin Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 LOL, I don't know why it's a concern. I've never had a patient (or seen one) that I would even remotely consider interesting in a dating sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HopeToBeGreen Posted July 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 So where are these guidelines? Here they are: http://www.cpso.on.ca/policies/policies/default.aspx?ID=1604 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clever Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 He reports that they did go out and the date was like a dream...except then he found out that she was gay. Reminds me of a girl I used to work with Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apache Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 honestly, outside of psychiatry (for obvious reasons that should be self evident) i don't see this as a faux paux at all, so im your doctor and treat your infection in the e.r., how does that create an inappropriate power relationship which might compromise the integrity of the profession, patient-doctor relationship or future relationship? the only caveat would be that you should immediately discontinue being the persons physician. if i like my endocrinologist and she's handling my diabetes i see no reason why we shouldn't be allowed to start dating after she immediately refers me to another endo, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kylamonkey Posted July 24, 2011 Report Share Posted July 24, 2011 doctors dating patients Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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