Should I Transfer Out Of Uoft?

[Blue Sky]

Hi everyone, I currently go to school at utm/utsg (taking a half of my classes at each campus) I have a 3.21 OMSAS GPA (all courses taken including summers) and I am currently in my 2nd year. I did not start off strong (2.9 in first year) and I am wondering if I should maybe transfer to York, but don't know if that will make a difference. I would rather go to Mac or Western but I don't want to rack up more debt for housing.  I looked at the NSERC research projects for York and there are very few, and most of them were engineering related anyway. In addition to that I hear a lot of bad things about York (sexual assaults and incidents), but I liked the campus and my sister wants to go there next year.  I am currently doing research with the history department at UTM, as much as I don't like it very much, I feel it was a unique opportunity that can help me get something closer to my field of study.  There is so much more opportunities, but my marks are not good enough to make me stand out.

 

I don't know if it is time to give up on med school or not. How would anyone know that? Is it more of an institution problem or am I the problem.. I am sorry to bore you with this..

 

 

Thank you,

[Dr. Octavius]

No reason to give up on med. Consider that some schools look at best/last two years (ie. Western, Queens) for GPA. I suggest that you reflect on the cause for your current grades (procrastination? poor study habits? wrong major/not interested in material?) and whether the school has anything to do with it (you don't like the atmosphere/learning environment, home sickness - which it doesn't sound like - etc.). If you can't attribute any of this to your current school, then a switch may not be as helpful as you think.

Sexual assaults happen quite often downtown Toronto as well, but rarely are these ever associated with one of the schools there. I think York gets a bad reputation because these sorts of things happen near campus (ie. Jane + Finch) most of the time. Most security bulletins issued for York pertain to crimes that happened near campus.

 

I am pretty sure NSERCs are awarded on the basis for grades even at UTM, so I wouldn't list this as a con for York.

 

I hope this helps.

[Egg_McMuffin]

I'm doing a second degree at Western (one of its affiliate campuses, to be more specific) right now after having completed my first degree at UTSG. I wish I transferred out of there a lot sooner. I agree that you need to do some self-reflection and try to see how you can improve, but the thing is the longer you rack up uncompetitive marks the more doors will be shut in your face come application time. I wouldn't only count on the schools that look at last 2 years, because their MCAT/other criteria may be harder to meet. I'm not saying that you can't meet them, but you just never know...not everyone can pull off a 95%ile on the MCAT so don't assume it'll be you. In terms of research opportunities, I'd say your concern is not an issue until you can pull your marks up. When you get a solid year or 2 of 4.0s you can have your pick of research projects, be it at York or any other institution, because profs will be that much more receptive to your applications.

 

Of course, this is just my own biased opinion.

[j17f]

Come to Western dawg, it's so FTBs fitfam throwback thursday.

[Slashsev]

yes uoft will ruin your life

[Edict]

Honestly i'm not exactly sure whether or not its worth it. In my opinion you should just stick your degree out. I don't think you'd notice a dramatic change in your GPA at York. If medical school is absolutely all you ever want, maybe its worth switching but no guarantees that switching will fix things. People from UofT as well as York get into medical school all the time. If i'm going to be honest though UofT sends several times more students to medical school than York does. 

 

Research is something you should be more concerned about when your GPA is in the target range, if your GPA isn't there I wouldn't worry about NSERC just yet because research isn't mandatory for medical school whereas a good GPA its much easier to improve research on your resume even post-graduation. 

[DoctorAM]

More people I know than I can count went to UofT for UG (usually in Life Science) and then transferred out to other schools, usually York or Ryerson. A lot of my friends who decided to tough it out in their programs regret it. UofT fosters a very competitive environment, that could make getting into research and stuff fairly difficult.

 

More people get into Medicine from UofT, yes, but that may be because there are far more applicants to medical school from UofT. The school itself doesn't provide any advantage per se. 

 

Now I'm not trying to sway your decision, but this is what I've noticed. Like Edict said you aren't guaranteed to do better at one school over another. But if you can identify problems in your studies that trace back to the school you're at, for whatever reason, I would think seriously about making the switch. 

[Egg_McMuffin]

More people I know than I can count went to UofT for UG (usually in Life Science) and then transferred out to other schools, usually York or Ryerson. A lot of my friends who decided to tough it out in their programs regret it. UofT fosters a very competitive environment, that could make getting into research and stuff fairly difficult.

And don't forget the psychological impact that environment can have, which might make your life more difficult than just making it harder to land research positions. What I'm really bitter about, above anything else, was how demoralized and worthless that environment made me feel. Once I started feeling that way, I think everything just went downhill from there. You can stay at UofT and tough it out and maybe things will improve, but the process will be more exhausting. Yes I'm doing better better in my second degree at Western because I have the luxury of taking lower level electives and I'm studying better, etc. but it's not like I didn't try to take bird courses at UofT, and frankly I know my improved studying habits didn't change drastically enough for me to receive 10-15% higher marks.

 

I just submitted my transcripts from both UofT and Western for internships...the class averages are not even comparable. Neither are the caliber of the 'competition' in your classes.

 

Yeah it's not a guarantee that things will improve if you transfer out, but then at least you'll have the satisfaction of knowing that you tried. When I was at UofT people said the same thing to me..."it's not a guarantee things will improve, things get better in upper year at UofT, etc. etc." and I listened. Had I not, maybe I wouldn't needed to do 7 years of undergrad just to get my file looked at.

[StriveP]

Honestly i'm not exactly sure whether or not its worth it. In my opinion you should just stick your degree out. I don't think you'd notice a dramatic change in your GPA at York. If medical school is absolutely all you ever want, maybe its worth switching but no guarantees that switching will fix things. People from UofT as well as York get into medical school all the time. If i'm going to be honest though UofT sends several times more students to medical school than York does. 

 

Research is something you should be more concerned about when your GPA is in the target range, if your GPA isn't there I wouldn't worry about NSERC just yet because research isn't mandatory for medical school whereas a good GPA its much easier to improve research on your resume even post-graduation. 

 

I know someone who transferred from UofT to York in his 2nd year and his GPA did go up. I believe the guy just finished med school at McMaster. But to be fair, it could be due to several factors since he did transfer to the easiest program at York (Kine) and he started studying more efficiently.

 

OP I don't think it maybe an institution problem. Try finding out why you are doing poorly and eliminate those factors. If nothing works, then transfer. And York is a good school, keep in mind assaults happen at EVERY institution. 

[xiaoyy]

Honestly, a major problem is how UofT teaches, and how competitive it is. UofT teaches the basic knowledge and logic that you'll need for your tests, rather than teaching how the students should prepare for the test. Also, you'll have to consider that you're probably competing with people all around the world, with different ethnicity backgrounds, with the same goal of becoming a doctor.

[geriatricsdoc]

Yeah it's not a guarantee that things will improve if you transfer out, but then at least you'll have the satisfaction of knowing that you tried. When I was at UofT people said the same thing to me..."it's not a guarantee things will improve, things get better in upper year at UofT, etc. etc." and I listened. Had I not, maybe I wouldn't needed to do 7 years of undergrad just to get my file looked at.

damn! just wow

[Neurophilic]

Honestly, a major problem is how UofT teaches, and how competitive it is. UofT teaches the basic knowledge and logic that you'll need for your tests, rather than teaching how the students should prepare for the test. Also, you'll have to consider that you're probably competing with people all around the world, with different ethnicity backgrounds, with the same goal of becoming a doctor.

I don't think their job is to teach you how to prepare for tests and exams. I believe that's up to the student. Also, I'm not aware of any university that really teaches you how to prepare for a test. They simply give you lectures and/or tutorials and say, "this material will be on the midterm or final". 

 

With respect to competition with people of the same goal of becoming a doctor, all universities have this. Everybody that wants to be a doctor doesn't end up going to UofT and there are no stats that show there are more people who want to become a doctor at UofT compared to any other university.

 

I don't think that there is much of a problem with UofT, rather it is the students who have not yet found how to study efficiently trying to make excuses as to why their performance is as it is. As long as a University provides you with the information which is required for tests and examinations, then it is possible to do extremely well at any university. However, whether a student does well or not is largely a function of their study habits and the degree to which they seek other resources when having difficulty.  

[AntiSWOMEN]

I understand that it may be more difficult to do well at certain institutions, but considering your GPA you should think about what you are doing wrong and how you can personally improve. Having a 3.21 GPA from a difficult school does not necessarily mean you'll be doing much better at another school. I'd advise trying to tweak your study habits and look into course selection before thinking of transferring.

 

You can still have a good shot everywhere but Mac in terms of GPA if you do well starting this year.

[Slashsev]

^ yes it does, 

thats EXACTLY what a DIFFICULT school means

 lol

[YorkMD]

I had many friends come to York thinking it was going to be a free ride and they did not end up doing as well as they thought they would. 

 

That being said, if you think a change of scenery will help you focus a bit more or remain a little more motivated (or anything else that contributes directly or indirectly to getting your grades where you want them to be) I say switch. York has been fair to me during my undergrad degree with almost all of my courses giving me the amount of work I put in. Like I said; that doesn't mean putting in a "good" effort will net you 90s but if you make it your mission to put in all you got you will almost always get that mark back out of your classes.

 

Obviously I can't attest to any other schools and I don't know for sure if I would have received the same marks elsewhere because I never attended any other institution. I debated between York and U of T when I left high school but went to York because it gave me the ability to commute less, live at home, be in a more familiar environment with a less competitive environment; all things I figured would benefit me in the long run that would inadvertently affect my studies. Think about all of these factors and whether you would benefit from them (more time to study? more motivation with less time spent commuting?).

 

You may not have found the best way to study yet and that's something you have to be honest with yourself about. If it's the overall environment or something you can't put your finger on explicitly, it may be some of the factors I mentioned. It's up to you to decide what will work best for you and what to do about it and I just wanted to give you a bit of advice of what worked for me.

 

Best of luck with your studies and I hope you find something that works for you. 

[AntiSWOMEN]

^ yes it does,

thats EXACTLY what a DIFFICULT school means

lol

No it doesn't I know of some people who have transferred, blaming their shortcomings on their previous institution only to find out it was mostly their own problem still doing poorly at their new school.

 

All I am saying is look at yourself before thinking you can't do well where you are and don't expect a 3.21 to translate to a 3.9+ just because it's from UofT because chances are it won't if the problem is you.

[_ _]

^ yes it does, 

thats EXACTLY what a DIFFICULT school means

 lol

That's exactly what MIGHT happen at a difficult school. I've seen people transfer for this reason and see no grade improvement because they slacked off, got used to being around people who don't study like crazy, etc.