Is Med School even viable for me? What should I do..?

[StellarRay]

Geez, it looks like the troll-hunting troop has finally passed after about 3-4 pages of patting each other on the back...

 

msiwoski:

I don't recall you actually asking me why I haven't got a summer job... but I did do a post search on all your posts and I'm going to assume you were referring to this:

 

Also, get a f***ing job and start paying them off. You mentioned you have free time to think right now as it's summer; If you have time, go work.

 

Which I then "answered" with...

 

I really wouldn't mind just working to repay my parents. But I'm 100% positive that they wouldn't care so much about the money but rather, much like myself, they're more interested in the time that's been wasted. McDonald's pays what... $8/hr? Lets say I work 40 hrs/wk. That's $320/wk. To repay back approximately $30,000 would take around 100 weeks or so after taxes. That's about 2 more years of working full-time. I doubt my parents want that but hey, it's a possibility.

 

But to elaborate on that for just a moment, I have been activately searching for a summer job since around March. But it's been kind of hard to find a job without a degree or diploma and without the "Student" status that many of the government run or government subsidized jobs require. My dad, as you know, has recently been laid off and so the student summer jobs program at his work that I use to work every summer has been obsolete since last year. And frankly, I'm finding it hard to go to interviews and smile and be all pleasant when deep-down I feel like absolute ****. But yes, I am still actively looking. And most likely I will have to "settle" for working at Mickey Dees. Beggers can't be choosers and my lack of customer service at my age is kind of appalling. I just never imagined I would ever really need customer service jobs and thus usually worked the higher paying construction/factory summer jobs. I've also been super busy trying to speak to counsellors and admission officials while volunteering and seeking that professional help I've been suggested so many times. >_>'

 

Dude, I'm really sorry about your situation. Yes, you are in a very difficult position, but I can assure you - there is still hope. Some schools (e.g.: Queen's and UWO) look at 2 years' GPA. So once you get back to school, make sure you put 100% effort to get the best out of those 2 years. I know that Queen's doesn't bother wheather or not you were suspended in the past - they would just look at most recent 2 years' GPA. I'm pretty sure about this because I had a friend who was in EXACT same situation in the past and I just had to call every medical school for information in effort to pull him up from the "hole of self-hatred" (just couldn't stand there and watch him crying every night - he was one of my best friends).

 

PM me if you need a cheer-up

 

Thanks, that does cheer me up. You're a good friend. I'm finding it hard now to reconnect to my best friends after hiding from everyone for so long. Sometimes it feels like we're good friends that just haven't talked in awhile. Other times, it feels like we're merely acquaintices now.

 

pamela22:

I think, as it stands, my fastest route is Carribean schools but it also presents the greatest risk. If by some chance in hell, they look at me and give me the 2nd chance I've been looking for then wow. Yes, 3 yrs of pre-med + 4 yrs of MD. Brook has even suggested that since it's run in terms, that it's possible to finish the pre-med in 2 yrs if staying on the island wasn't a prob. Re-doing all the courses and waiting out the suspension would be the longest road (3 yrs suspension, 4 yrs undergrad, possibly 2 yrs of masters, and 4 yrs MD = 7-13 yrs) and still obviously no guarantee of med school at the end. But the longer road does afford some options like picking up a diploma, work experience, volunteer experience,...

 

The middle road appears to be to take the online courses/college courses and apply as a transfer student and try to get like 2 yrs head start on the new undergrad while suspended. I'm just worried about how feasible this is. Also how do med schools look upon people doing their pre-reqs as an online university/college transfer credit? For Queens, Western, and Dalhousie.. they supposedly only look at your last 2 (best) yrs for the GPA but do they consider what mark you obtained in the pre-reqs? Especially since universities already disregard college GPAs.

 

Thanks for all the support. It's been a summer like no other.. it really has. =\

[pamela22]

pamela22:

I think, as it stands, my fastest route is Carribean schools but it also presents the greatest risk. If by some chance in hell, they look at me and give me the 2nd chance I've been looking for then wow. Yes, 3 yrs of pre-med + 4 yrs of MD. Brook has even suggested that since it's run in terms, that it's possible to finish the pre-med in 2 yrs if staying on the island wasn't a prob. Re-doing all the courses and waiting out the suspension would be the longest road (3 yrs suspension, 4 yrs undergrad, possibly 2 yrs of masters, and 4 yrs MD = 7-13 yrs) and still obviously no guarantee of med school at the end. But the longer road does afford some options like picking up a diploma, work experience, volunteer experience,...

 

The middle road appears to be to take the online courses/college courses and apply as a transfer student and try to get like 2 yrs head start on the new undergrad while suspended. I'm just worried about how feasible this is. Also how do med schools look upon people doing their pre-reqs as an online university/college transfer credit? For Queens, Western, and Dalhousie.. they supposedly only look at your last 2 (best) yrs for the GPA but do they consider what mark you obtained in the pre-reqs? Especially since universities already disregard college GPAs.

 

Thanks for all the support. It's been a summer like no other.. it really has. =\

 

Actually, I wasn't suggesting you repeat every course. If you dedicate yourself to hard work it CAN be done less than 2 years. By that I mean making a few sacrifices, like (re)taking 3 or 4 courses in the summer while taking the max number of courses during the regular year, and not slacking off for a second. You need focus and a determination at this point, imho. It's normal for you to feel a little shaken up by everything that has already happened. Take a minute to overcome everything and then plan. You might want to look up MDapplicants.com--there are a few people who got in with low 3.0 undergrad GPA and some that also went on to do masters. These people have made it in. Why? Because of the motivation. Don't be hung up on marks; the essay is where you need to shine!

 

ps. as for the 3 year suspension, if you improved your GPA slightly, could you not bring forth an appeal to that decision?

 

Pam

[rmorelan]

Pam is right about the appeal process. You would be surprised what the review committee will agree too with a proper appeal.

 

Obviously I cannot speak for them, but even one year of anything with a reasonably high GPA would be enough likely get them to agree to let you back in.

 

Also if you pick the right school for those online courses there will actually be nothing to signify the courses are any different than in class courses. Waterloo for instance treats them exactly the same - same course code, same appearance on the transcript. I believe this is because the courses there actually ARE the same and they are not alone in this.

[StellarRay]

Pam is right about the appeal process. You would be surprised what the review committee will agree too with a proper appeal.

 

Obviously I cannot speak for them, but even one year of anything with a reasonably high GPA would be enough likely get them to agree to let you back in.

 

Also if you pick the right school for those online courses there will actually be nothing to signify the courses are any different than in class courses. Waterloo for instance treats them exactly the same - same course code, same appearance on the transcript. I believe this is because the courses there actually ARE the same and they are not alone in this.

 

I was actually considering this as well, by doing really well in a year of college then petitioning. If I'm going to college to pick up say the paramedic or practical nursing diploma then it'd be somewhat of a waste though.

 

Now this is really really interesting. You mentioned that some schools have the same course codes so same courses literally. So where are these "right" schools that have the exact same course codes?? I'm finding it hard to even find the same courses between universities.. let alone finding university courses (ie Orgo chem with lab) in college or online. =\

 

I believe, it'll show up in the transcript, but there won't be a mark assigned to it. Just that it was completed. My ongoing question, which I still have some calls to make myself, is if med schools will consider this acceptable? Because it seems a tad unfair if I'm in college (which med schools probably already consider "easier") and getting 60s in all my med school pre-req courses then transferring them so that no actual grade shows up. Then in my last 2 yrs I take bird courses. I know some schools have some kind of weighted system in terms of how many pre-reqs or level of difficulty of courses that you have to take each term/year... but yeah, I'm a little lost about that.

 

Also about re-taking courses, is it bad to re-take a course you've already passed? Are we even allowed to re-take a course we've passed? What if it was a crummy mark? In my chaos I have already re-taken orgo chem twice and still a crummy mark.

[pamela22]

At this point don't worry about what looks "good"... if you re-took orgo and passed it.. then don't re-take it.. rather redo courses that you know you'll get over 80s in (even if you already passed those courses). You have to first meet the cut-offs and then write an amazing essay explaining the path you took. You'd be surprised how much an essay can influence an applicant's acceptance. That's why you see some people with 4.0s not getting in while others with 3.5s getting in.

 

...and if you have the time, I highly, highly recommend you read Vincent Lam's book, 'Bloodletting & Miraculous Cures'... it'll give you the strength and motivation to keep going if medicine is truly where you want to end up.

 

Pam

[avenir001]

for western at least, u need 10 courses/year in ur best 2 years to be considered...a course u're taking for the second time doesn't count as one of those 10 courses...in other words, if any of ur courses are repeats, they don't count and u'll still have to take 10 "new" courses/yr.

[rmorelan]

I was actually considering this as well, by doing really well in a year of college then petitioning. If I'm going to college to pick up say the paramedic or practical nursing diploma then it'd be somewhat of a waste though.

 

Maybe but I doubt having anything medically related is a waste at all. At the very least it shows commitment and exposure to the field. Remember the GPA etc just gets you to the interview. Once there stuff like that has a big impact. In these forums sometimes I think at least the focus is too much on GPA. Its a long race to med school, and you will need to plan for the entire course.

 

Now this is really really interesting. You mentioned that some schools have the same course codes so same courses literally. So where are these "right" schools that have the exact same course codes?? I'm finding it hard to even find the same courses between universities.. let alone finding university courses (ie Orgo chem with lab) in college or online. =\

 

Well that is something you would have to research, but really it wouldn't be hard. Just ask every school - there aren't that many in total and I know right now at least (unfortunately) you have the "free time" to do it. I know waterloo doesn't consider them any different, and Guelph does. Also I am not convinced that many med schools would even care. A course is a course if it is from a good school.

[polarb]

But to elaborate on that for just a moment, I have been activately searching for a summer job since around March. But it's been kind of hard to find a job without a degree or diploma and without the "Student" status that many of the government run or government subsidized jobs require. My dad, as you know, has recently been laid off and so the student summer jobs program at his work that I use to work every summer has been obsolete since last year. And frankly, I'm finding it hard to go to interviews and smile and be all pleasant when deep-down I feel like absolute ****. But yes, I am still actively looking. And most likely I will have to "settle" for working at Mickey Dees. Beggers can't be choosers and my lack of customer service at my age is kind of appalling. I just never imagined I would ever really need customer service jobs and thus usually worked the higher paying construction/factory summer jobs. I've also been super busy trying to speak to counsellors and admission officials while volunteering and seeking that professional help I've been suggested so many times. >_>'

 

 

Wow, I think right now, you just need to suck it up and get a job. No more excuses!

It is not hard to find a job. It is only hard because you are probably searching for jobs that are "subsidized" or medically related or $15 + or "elite". Don't! You don't have the credentials or the work ethic to do those jobs. Suck it up and get ANY job, A job that will pay you.

 

In the end, no matter what path you choose. Caribbean, college or waiting out to do your premed, you are going to need money (especially caribbean)!! Especially since your dad just got laid off, how can you still expect your parents to help you financially?

 

Sure that might mean you have to work at McDonalds. But I'm sure we all had a summer job that was less than "ideal". Everyone has to start at the bottom at some point and you are just starting later than others.

[MedPen]

I am not liking the OP's (and I use the term OP synonymously with troll) attitude lately. For someone who is supposedly so down on himself, he can really dish out the insults/attitude/superiority complex.

 

SUSPICIOUS OF THE TROLL.

[kevinkwon84]

I'm finding it hard now to reconnect to my best friends after hiding from everyone for so long.

 

Why don't you try calling your friends? I mean, friends are friends - they are always there to support you. It would be a lot better to ask them to hear out your situation than bunch of random people on the internet. Call them up, or at least the ones you felt bonded to, to chill out/go out for a drink/watch movies/etc. You must have been exhausted from all the stress and things you had to go through. Just take a day off, go out, and have fun. You can think things over after. Afterall, three years of suspension isn't the end of the world. There is still hope, so don't get too depressed now.

 

But there is something I want to suggest. Do get a summer job. To be honest, what other people (some rather rude ones, I know) are saying in this forum are right - you really need to find a job ASAP. It doesn't matter wheather you work for $8/hr at McDonalds or $12/hr as a receptionist at a family clinic (where I work part-time right now) or $30/hr tutoring high school students. Getting a tutoring job isn't that difficult as you have already graduated from secondary school and got into UofT. Anyways, it is always better to find something to do than doing nothing especially in your situation. So just call your friends, relax for a day, and search up working opportunities through online/newspapers/etc.

 

Hope this helped.

 

Cheers.

 

 

PS: People reading this post- please be more considerate b/c what this person is going through may be harder than you can imagine. Let's not become too judgemental and try to be more of help.

[Waxwing]

It sounds like you are feeling extremely overwhelmed, which is completely understandable. I think you need to make sure you know what you want to do and do whatever it takes to get there. I have been faced with some very tough challenges and worked numerous jobs throughout university in order to pay for it. Unfortunately although it got me a degree, I may be looking at paying for another one since my undergrad GPA is not high enough for medicine. Things like this happen and what medical schools respect is what you have gained from your experiences, how they have matured you, and what you have done in order to get yourself where you want to be. Call every admissions office and speak to them about your situation (in less detail of course). Let them know your GPA and ask them what you should be doing to get in. Some may say graduate work would help and others would say a couple more years of school. You may have to work in order to continue putting yourself through school, but you gotta do what you gotta do. If you do have 2 final full years left, if you make them good enough, you may have an excellent chance of being considered. Make sure you're becoming a doctor because this is what you want to do, not because you want approval or respect because you have a long road ahead of you, as do I... but knowing what's at the end can give you the strength and encouragement to continue on. Stay positive and try to look at this as an experience that will make you a better doctor in the end.

Hope this helps.

[webshy]

I was in a similar situation after my first three years of university. I had a few crises in my home life, which were very distracting. In addition, I was very young and unmotivated. I knew I wanted to be a physician, but I didn't put the time into studying, or even attending classes. Rather than doing better each year, I did considerably worse. My average for my third year was 0.51, as I only wrote one final exam....

 

I had exceled in high school, graduating in 3.5 years in the days where high school was 5 years long. I had my choice of university programs, and got the top scholarship offered by the program I did chose. However, I didn't know how to buckle down and study.

 

Given everything going on, I made the decision to put my medical school dreams on the back-burner. I had to. I didn't know another way to stop hitting my head against the wall.

 

I went to college and became a paramedic. I loved it! I had lots of patient contact, and had a "fresh start" so to speak. Almost overnight, I went from being a very insecure, unhappy university student to a college student who was loving what I was doing, and thus, finally learning to study again. My college environment was more supportive than the university one where I felt lost.

 

I didn't become a paramedic to help me get into med school. I needed a job, and at the time, getting into med school wasn't an option. I like working with people, and like health care. I focused on being the best paramedic possible, without worrying about what I might do if I later decided to try for med school again.

 

I started working full time as a paramedic in 1999. I really did enjoy my job. I was no longer thinking about trying to get into med school, at least partially because I didn't think I had a chance of admission. My overall GPA was around 1.5, with 0.51 in my final year. Yikes!

 

However, in the summer of 2002, I was with some friends in a computer lab, searching random stuff on the internet. I landed at the site for Queen's med school, and learned that they would consider just the most recent two years of undergrad as an alternative to all undergrad years. I e-mailed the admissions office, and was told that regardless of how poor my initial marks were, I could get in if I had strong marks in my final two years (and a strong MCAT).

 

In September 2002, I went back to university, first part time. Since I had been requried to withdraw, they would only allow me to take two courses my first term. I had a drive in school that I had never had before, and was off probation in two terms. After showing I could get As on my first two courses, I was allowed to take 4 courses during my second term. I was well on the way to getting strong marks I needed for med school. I graduated in 2004 just 0.1 away from making the Dean's List. I graduated with a very small class, and there was a reception afterward where my Program Director made a really big deal about my improvement. My parents didn't get it though, since I had never told them why I left university. I just said that I wanted to become a paramedic. That's one regret - I should have shared. I could have used their support.

 

Anyway, onto the next hurdle - the MCAT. Because I was only eligible to apply to a few universities, the ones that consider just two years of university, I knew I needed at least a 30. I wrote the MCAT three times, but couldn't get above 28. I was back to feeling as though I was hitting my head against the wall. So again, I took a step back. I applied for a promotion at work, and decided to pursue my options in EMS.

 

Again, I wasn't following my career path in order to help me get into med school. I just needed a break. While I had done well in university, I had been working full time while taking a more than full course load. I was tired. I just needed a bit of time away from school.

 

A year and a half ago now, my manager sat me down to ask me why I had never considered a career in medicine. I went away from our meeting thinking a lot about what I want to do for the next thirty years. I knew it was medicine. Thus, I decided to give the MCAT one more try. This time, I got the mark I needed - 32R. When I applied to med school last September, I was confident that I would get at least one interview.

 

Despite my very poor start to university, I got three interviews and three offers to med school (one off the waiting list). That said, had I kept pursuing undergrad at the time when I left, I probably still wouldn't have gained admission. I needed to focus on something else for a few years before gaining the drive to turn my marks around. I needed a break from academia.

 

Yes, there would be advantages of being younger starting med school. However, I don't regret the nine years that I've worked as a paramedic/supervisor. I've gained both patient care and people skills that I wouldn't have had I not had the opportunity to work in EMS. I am much better prepared now to become a physician than I would have been nine years ago.

 

It *is* possible for you to get into med school one day, despite your struggles. The road is going to be a bit longer than some of your classmates, but that doesn't mean there aren't schools that will look at just your later marks. That said, perhaps you need to think about whether now is the best time to work on improving those marks. Personally, I needed some time away before going back to university.

 

I wish you all the best in the future.

 

Elaine

[tyro]

I can totally understand your situation, as I am Asian myself and understand the pressure that Asian parents can put on their children. If I were you, I too would be terrified to tell my parents if I were in your situation. But wouldn't they get suspicious and find out anyway, if you've been going to university for five years, and still have not received a degree? What if they ask to see your marks, or the diploma? What if they want to go to your convocation? I understand why you would not tell your parents, but they are going to find out soon I'm sure, and that will be way worse than you telling them yourself.

 

I have not read this entire thread, so some of this advice may have already been given. There are a few things you can do. You should finish your current degree, and start a second one. Perhaps in something you find less challenging, or that you would enjoy learning about. I really think though that you are not ready to start this September, based on what you have been writing. I know you want to appeal your situation, but I really think you should take at least a year off from school - to better yourself mentally, see a psychologist regularly, and reflect on why you did so poorly and why you want to do med school. You should definately try to find a job during the year, and this summer as well. Especially if you think your parents are going to kick you out, if/when they find out. But you really need to figure out WHY you did so badly, so that you don't mess up again.

 

Or if you are worried about being too old and wasting your time, you could just go to a foreign medical school now. They might even accept you based on your high school marks.

 

If you really want something, you have to prove it and work hard for it, and I don't think you are doing that right now. It is hard to go from a 1.37 student over not just one year, but five years, to a 3.90 student instantly. Realistically, you will probably go from being a D student, to perhaps a B student in your next year, and then perhaps finally an A student in the following year.

 

I really feel bad for you. But I know you can get through this, and you will. Best of luck.

[Pantaloons]

...It *is* possible for you to get into med school one day, despite your struggles. The road is going to be a bit longer than some of your classmates, but that doesn't mean there aren't schools that will look at just your later marks. That said, perhaps you need to think about whether now is the best time to work on improving those marks. Personally, I needed some time away before going back to university.

 

I wish you all the best in the future.

 

Elaine

 

Elaine,

 

Thank-you for sharing your story--it was really inspiring.

I hope that you'll find the fulfillment you seek in medicine, and I wish you all the best!

Hopefully, I'll get into medicine myself, and maybe we'll be colleagues one day.

 

- Y

[agray33]

I also want to thank you for your story elaine. I have found many of your posts really inspiring.

[StellarRay]

kevinkwon84:

I do call my friends up but I feel as though there's not many who are willing to make the time to pick up where we left off like 5 yrs ago. Everyone's so busy with their own lives. Some are in their final years finishing up their undergrad, others are busy looking for a place to stay for the next 2 yrs of their grad schooling, some are working full-time, and others are starting their families. I feel like I'm constantly burdening the 1 or 2 friends that I have left.

 

I've considered going into tutoring before because high school kids tutor all the time and I should in theory have the upperhand since I'm a high school grad and go to U of T. But at the same time, I've always feared that I wouldn't know the answer. It's been 3-5 yrs since I've looked at the high school curriculum and I feel like I've lost alot of confidence in myself after bombing out so badly as I did. It's not like I think of myself as "above" any line of work, since I have been working very blue collar jobs for the past 5-6 yrs, but it's been really hard to apply for jobs with that sort of experience/work history. Sure, I can rant about how great the teamwork is on the assembly line but in the end it's still just me lifting 50 lb automobile parts for 8-12 hrs a day.

 

Waxwing:

I've been calling the admission offices but sometimes I wonder just how serious they are over the phone. I mean, I'm trying to plan a road that will take another 4-5 yrs minimum but possibly 7-9 yrs easily and I'm worried they're on the phone possibly thinking of what's for lunch or what they're planning to do tonight after work. The U of T med school admission officer was really nice but I just don't know how realistic her advice is given that I've noticed after hitting rock bottom that everything in life is so systematic and structured. If I don't get a certain cutoff then I won't get pass the some hypotheotical computer that screens all applicants. The U of T med school admission officer suggested that I use the time off to explore alot of ECs that regular 4 yr undergrad students wouldn't have and that I get my masters before applying as there's a lower cutoff for master students. However, I forget if they actually look at your cGPA from your undergrad still even if you're applying as a grad student. Does anyone remember?

 

elaine:

I have to agree with everyone else. It truly is an inspiring story! What's even more amazing is how much your story seems so much like my own. And the road that you took to med school is one that I've been considering for the past week!

 

You mentioned how you just stumbled across Queen's "last 2 yr" deal with some friends in a computer lab and you never knew such a thing existed before. That's how exactly how I felt. Given my horrible cGPA, for the longest time I thought med school was not an option for me and I lost so much passion and interest in school because I thought I had already lost the battle after my first screw up. Had I known that my first academic screw up in 2nd year wasn't the end all then who knows what that glimmer of hope would've done for me.

 

But right now, as much as people berate me about how long this thread is, I really want to absorb as much collective knowledge that's out there so I can make the right choice faster. I'm not suggesting that you wasted anytime as a paramedic since you said you loved it but I've been looking at a future of working in the same bumper factory as my dad which is something I can't say I loved. If just an extra piece of knowledge could save me a year of my life then I'm not ashamed to look like a pig on this forum. That's not to say that I haven't been doing my own research actively or that I'm trying to "cut corners". But if I can save a year or two years of my life then so be it. It's alot of time. In a year or two this thread will be washed away to the back somewhere, most of you will have had so many amazing experiences, seasons will have come and gone, who knows what will happen.. but it's alot of time.

 

Could you possibly tell me more about where you lived? What school you went to to become a paramedic? Was it the 2 yr college diploma? Do you know if there's anyway to combine doing paramedicine and Brook's idea of doing credits and transferring them back into a new university degree (thus saving me 1 to 2 yrs off the new degree)?

 

I've really got no idea on how paramedicine works. I don't know what colleges are "better" or more recognized than others for their paramedicine program. I've discovered there to be approximately 4 levels of paramedics (1st responder, Beginner, Advanced Care, and Critical Care?) which is largely based on education level and experience. There's the 6 weeks 1st responder course that Dr.Cave mentioned but I have no idea how "in-demand" that job is or the job security. First Responders make an average of $25,000/yr. Many community colleges around Toronto to Durham offer 2 yr Paramedicine programmes which I guess would land a job in the entry paramedic position above 1st responders. This position generates about $35,000/yr. Before anyone attacks me for going into medicine for the money... I'm only looking at the paramedic salaries because I will have to consider my expenses (might be kicked out by my parents =\), if I plan to keep pursuing med school if I'd be financially stable to do so and if so how long would that take, and to see which one is more worthwhile both financially and academically to pursue (6 week training course vs actual college diploma).

 

But really, elaine, what helps me the most from your story is that even though I thought this was a possible road to med school for me, I wasn't ever sure. But now here's someone that's cleared alot of the bush and come back to tell me that this path does lead to where I want to go. And I thank you for that. Thank you so much for taking the time to come back! ^^

 

I think my little sister actually first recommended me to this site based on one of your old posts, elaine.

 

Out of curiousity did you ever try to apply to the med schools in the States? Does anyone know if they have med schools with similar "last 2 yrs" or "best 2 yrs" promos?

[Dr.Cave]

http://www.onsitemedical.ca/careers.aspx

 

http://www.infooil.com/fx/jobs/listings/1.181907/ofa.level.iii.emrs.aspx

 

links to jobs you could get with EMR course. Note you will make over 40k/yr in the oil fields. There is a lot of demand in the oil fields

[StellarRay]

Thanks for the links, Dr.Cave. I guess I'm still in a little disbelief that with a 5-7 week course that I could land a full-time job just like that. Presuming it's 8 hrs/day (not likely, I know), 5 days/week, 50 weeks/yr (2 weeks vacation?) that comes to about $20/hr...

 

I'm just wondering, since I'm still just the sheltered boy that I am, do I need to get some kind of residency permit or something to work in another province like Alberta (I live in Ontario, have been all my life)?

 

I'm just really considering this option right now if my parents do give me the boot (which a few of you agreed they should.. >_>). Just so much to figure out. Looking for a place to stay, paying for that place to stay, figuring out what to do with my future, how I'd find my way back to med school... just so much growing up to do huh? ^^

 

If elaine or someone who's went the college route for paramedicine could give a little comparison of that to this EMR/EMP route that'd be awesome. I expect obviously that the 2 yr college grads get higher rank, higher pay than those with just the EMR training. But what about other things?

 

Like in my situation, maybe going to college would be better.

- First and foremost I'd still be in the classroom

- I could show them my improved grades/studying (possibly petition to get a year off? hopeful, i know)

- I'd get a diploma which is probably more marketable than 5-7 week training certificate

- Possibly get some transfer credits to shorten the time on doing a new undergrad degree (up to 2 yrs saved?)

 

But the downside of going to college is that:

- I'd have about half year to really work full-time before my suspension is up and thus allowing me to resume school (which I so whole-heartedly plan to do)

- Whereas with the EMR course, I could be working as soon as September. Giving me about 2 yrs of being able to work generating approximately 2 yr x $40,000/yr = ~$80,000.

 

My head hurts.

 

After seeing the thread about volunteering abroad I really want to give that a try too. I'd love that right about now. To get away from it all. But given my circumstances, perhaps I should be better saving my money to pay for rent and training/college fees... sigh.

[Rock*]

I'm just wondering, since I'm still just the sheltered boy that I am, do I need to get some kind of residency permit or something to work in another province like Alberta (I live in Ontario, have been all my life)?

 

LOL! Alberta may seem like another country sometimes, but it isn't ACTUALLY a different country. You don't need to do anything but move there and change your health card/driver's license eventually.

[kevinkwon84]

StellarRay,

 

Let me say this objectively - things worsen if nothing is done. Yes, I can't even imagine what you are going through right now. Your situation is tough (suspension from university, worsening relationship with your parents, friends, etc) and your loss of confidence/ current lack of commitment is totally understandable. However, that really should be just a temporary thing. At certain point of your life (I mean NOW) you should learn to stand up and continue running. It shouldn't lag you down forever - you are risking much more loss than university suspension. Really, you can take it to the bank.

 

You mentioned about "fear" when I suggested you about turing highschool students. Dude, I'm sure everyone on this forum went through "fear" at least once. Believe me, I went through that emotion many times in my life. But we all learned how to deal with such harsh situation and thus matured. You really got to challenge whats in front of you and try to avoid further loss.

 

All I see from you, StellarRay, is a scared young man. Don't get me wrong, I'm not judging you. But based on your previous posts, you are neglecting almost all the suggestions given by other people. You are looking for an "easy way out" to get out from this ****hole. But there is no short cut! 3 years of suspension is 3 years of suspension. You've got yourself into this, so only you can make it out from this. No one else, but you. So stop being whiny and choosy, and go out look for what is available to you. You won't reach any solution by sitting in front of your computer and asking people on this forum for suggestions.

 

I, myself, been tutoring not only highschool students but also some 1st years. There are many organizations where they hire university students to tutor highschool students, and they don't even require you to submit transcripts. If you just look out, there is almost always an opportunity.

 

I'd be happy to see you changing. PM me whenever you like. We can talk more about ourselves. I am fascinated.

 

 

Cheers.

 

 

PS: Just read your most recent post. It's good to see you considering something. But don't consider downsides too much, as you do not have much options. Careful analysis on possible paths is good, but try to emphasize more on pros than cons.

[kevinkwon84]

My other suggestion: Forget about going back to UofT and try Athabasca. My friend took their courses for a year (yes, he was on suspension too), and managed to get into dentistry (UWO). Not sure about med tho.....you should check up.

[Dr.Cave]

Ray,

 

Highschool dropouts routinely go to the oilfields and make 100K a year working dangerous jobs, so it shouldn't be so hard to believe that with a bit of training you can work there for less $$$ in a non dangerous job. I wouldn't look at it as a permanent solution but just as the first baby step. If you like it then you could do the full paramedic route independently with $$$ that you save. Then maybe follow Elaine's footsteps

[Dr. Acula]

kevinkwon84:

 

elaine:

I have to agree with everyone else. It truly is an inspiring story! What's even more amazing is how much your story seems so much like my own. And the road that you took to med school is one that I've been considering for the past week!

 

I just want to point out to you is that her story isn't really so much like your own. Why? She went into paramedicine out of interest and enthusiasm, never considering that it could be used as a stepping stone to medicine eventually. She was happy with her career as a paramedic. You're just trying to figure out how to get into medicine asap and see it as part of the "road to med school". Elaine's attitude was completely different, and much healthier. You've already expressed that you'd consider a lifelong career in something like paramedicine as "settling", which is particularly offensive to people like Elaine who are mature and hard working paramedics. The fact that she ended up in medicine in the end doesn't change the fact that her attitude was completely different.

[StellarRay]

Rock*:

LOL! Alberta may seem like another country sometimes, but it isn't ACTUALLY a different country. You don't need to do anything but move there and change your health card/driver's license eventually.

 

Oh ok. What currency do they use there?

 

 

 

 

 

just keeding!! ^^

 

kevinkwon84:

StellarRay,

 

Let me say this objectively - things worsen if nothing is done. Yes, I can't even imagine what you are going through right now. Your situation is tough (suspension from university, worsening relationship with your parents, friends, etc) and your loss of confidence/ current lack of commitment is totally understandable. However, that really should be just a temporary thing. At certain point of your life (I mean NOW) you should learn to stand up and continue running. It shouldn't lag you down forever - you are risking much more loss than university suspension. Really, you can take it to the bank.

 

Hey again. I know that I have to pick myself up now and start running. I don't have the time to just sit and think for a year or two or three. The problem for me was that once I tripped up, I gave up and just lay there on the track. I thought I had lost everything already. So now I have to start running. I just need to figure out what I'm running towards and what the best path for me to get there is.

 

Thus why I'm here. I am doing my own research and homework, but honestly this forum is just such an invaluable source of info. Since I joined this forum, I now know so much more and have so much more resources than I had a week or two ago!

 

All I see from you, StellarRay, is a scared young man. Don't get me wrong, I'm not judging you. But based on your previous posts, you are neglecting almost all the suggestions given by other people. You are looking for an "easy way out" to get out from this ****hole. But there is no short cut! 3 years of suspension is 3 years of suspension. You've got yourself into this, so only you can make it out from this. No one else, but you. So stop being whiny and choosy, and go out look for what is available to you. You won't reach any solution by sitting in front of your computer and asking people on this forum for suggestions.

 

PS: Just read your most recent post. It's good to see you considering something. But don't consider downsides too much, as you do not have much options. Careful analysis on possible paths is good, but try to emphasize more on pros than cons.

 

But what did you mean by me not taking suggestions? I've read everything that everyone's posted. The suggestion some here have made so casually that I should just tell my parents tonight over dinner or something doesn't make sense to me. It's just absurd to me. It's also repeatedy countered by what others have said, what my therapist has said, and what I know and that's to have a concrete plan ready. What were the suggestions that I'm not listening to?

 

By nature, I'm a very pessimistic person. It's just easier for me to consider the worst case scenario than it is for me to think everything is going to turn up sunshine and lollipops.

 

Dr.Cave:

Yeah, it is baby steps. Big baby steps. >_<

 

Babies usually don't run away from home to another.. umm.. province (but it feels more like another country ) and have to find a job and support themselves. Up till now I've been living a really sheltered life and that's all about to change. It's crazy lying awake in bed realising that you're old, regretting alot of choices.

 

But if I do go through with the EMR/EMP training and do land a job then hopefully I'll end up liking it. Maybe I could be doing the online schooling through Athabasca while working. Honestly, this forum is so invaluable. Just today I found this http://www.cvu-uvc.ca which lists all the accreditted online universities. Always learning something new here.

 

Dr. Acula:

If you say so. But I think elaine's story is very relatable and it looks very much like the road I'll be taking (maybe in combination with Brook's plan).

 

- We both needed a job (I most likely will get kicked out, need to repay parents)

- We both like working with people and healthcare (I volunteer at the hospital, community mediation, etc)

- Med school wasn't an option for her at the time and it's not an option for me now

- Being a physician was elaine's plan A, just like me, but when that wasn't possible at the time she turned to paramedicine as a plan B/C/D/whatever because of what was in common with being a physician and a paramedic (ie working with people and healthcare). She fell in love with it after. Who knows, maybe I will too?

 

And we've already had this talk about "settling" so I don't know why you're trying to start that fire again.

 

But as cocky as it might sound, the one thing I have over elaine is this knowledge of my options that she didn't realise even existed for her until a fateful day in the computer lab in the summer of 2002. To be honest, maybe this knowledge is a hindrance and I'm just poisoning myself with more delusions. When something is in fact over, maybe it's just best to not let the poor soul think that there's even the slightest chance left of getting it back. =\

 

Given everything going on, I made the decision to put my medical school dreams on the back-burner. I had to. I didn't know another way to stop hitting my head against the wall.

 

I went to college and became a paramedic. I loved it! I had lots of patient contact, and had a "fresh start" so to speak. Almost overnight, I went from being a very insecure, unhappy university student to a college student who was loving what I was doing, and thus, finally learning to study again. My college environment was more supportive than the university one where I felt lost.

 

I didn't become a paramedic to help me get into med school. I needed a job, and at the time, getting into med school wasn't an option. I like working with people, and like health care. I focused on being the best paramedic possible, without worrying about what I might do if I later decided to try for med school again.

 

I started working full time as a paramedic in 1999. I really did enjoy my job. I was no longer thinking about trying to get into med school, at least partially because I didn't think I had a chance of admission. My overall GPA was around 1.5, with 0.51 in my final year. Yikes!

 

However, in the summer of 2002, I was with some friends in a computer lab, searching random stuff on the internet. I landed at the site for Queen's med school, and learned that they would consider just the most recent two years of undergrad as an alternative to all undergrad years. I e-mailed the admissions office, and was told that regardless of how poor my initial marks were, I could get in if I had strong marks in my final two years (and a strong MCAT).

[kevinkwon84]

Well, many people here suggested being honest to your parents. I personally think that that is the first thing you must go through before moving up to the next step. You still have a long path to walk through, and believe me its going to be very enduring. It will be much tougher without your parents' assitance (financially, psychologically, etc). Yes, yes, it is not an easy topic to be brought up on a dinner table, but many people thinks you should be at least tell them the truth and ask for some help. I think at least 75% of people on this forum thinks the same way and thus suggested. But it seems like that is not an option for you although that is the first step to getting rid of your burden to great level. Neglection 1.

 

Secondly, you only think about the worst scenarios. I had suggested a tutoring job (which doesn't require submitting transcrits/ec lists, etc), but you neglected it by giving excuses. I am not blaming your pessimistic character, but its not always great to see a person saying, "I can't do this because of this and that....". Neglection 2.

 

I have an exam coming up in a week, so I can't go through 35 pages to come up with more examples. Plus, bringing out examples on people's personality is not my interest. But I really want you to be more optimistic on everything. Pessimistic character doesn't help with your current situation nor your future career (especially something related to health care).

 

Some people like Elaine made great progress in their lives. People fail once or twice in their lives, but they learn something from it. They were devoted to change, and thus it led to their success. Yes, you can be one of them in the future, but won't happen if you don't learn to be more optimistic and try to change and I really think being honest with you parents is the first step. Don't think of worst scenarios, and try to tackle everything that is in your way.