Medical School Second Undergrad Degree Policies (Updated Aug 8, 2012)

[NutritionRunner]

Of course

 

If I am completing my first undergraduate degree with a minor in Biology, would I be able to later complete a second undergraduate degree in Biology? Then any Biology credits from my first degree would transfer as credit for my second? Do I have that right?

 

Some universities won't let you complete a second degree in a subject that you've previously completed a major or minor in, so you really have to check with each university. Additionally, some universities won't let you complete the same "type" of degree - that is, if you have a BA, you can't do another BA, but need to do a BSc, BEng, BASc, etc.

 

Some universities also have rules about how "close" the two degrees can be. Some universities don't care, but some stipulate that both degrees can't have more than, say, 25% of the required core courses in common, so that the two degrees are significantly different (but you may still get up to 50% of the courses from the first degree transferred when you take into account electives).

 

Basically, each university has its own rules, so you have to carefully check the regulations for the schools that are of interest to you.

[healthnut]

Does anyone have any idea about the stipulations that these Universities have about whether or not you actually have to complete your second undergrad degree? Or is it possible to use the marks from courses you did, even if you don't end up conferring the second degree?

[Falling]

Does anyone know if McGill includes prereqs from a first degree in their prereq calculation? Their second degree policy is to focus on only the second degree, but I took 1 prereq during my first degree and I don't want that grade included, but I also wanted to spend next summer (when I'd have to take the course) doing research.

[Falling]

Does anyone have any idea about the stipulations that these Universities have about whether or not you actually have to complete your second undergrad degree? Or is it possible to use the marks from courses you did, even if you don't end up conferring the second degree?

 

I think Western requires that the second degree be completed (you can only apply in your last year of the degree).

 

Queen's and McGill do not care.

[maybenow]

So the University of Saskatchewan has finally come out with their updated policies regarding their medical school requirements. From my understanding, these changes are bad news for OOP applicants, as they must have an 83% average over their 4 years. Thus, my understanding is that OOP applicants will not be able to escape their bad first degrees with excellent second degrees, as all grades are now taken into account.

 

Der Kaiser, can you ask USask to clarify if outlaw's interpretation is correct?

I'm also interpreting that they only accept 4-year degrees and that if you have more than one 4-year degree, they'll take the higher.

 

Just wondering if you (or others involved in the thread at the time) have resolved this with USask.

 

Do they look at your last 48 months (i.e. 4 actual years of your 2nd degree), or do they just mean 48 months as a rough guestimate of the length of your 2nd degree, meaning if you did said 2nd degree in just 36, or 24 months (as many 2nd degree people would), you'd still qualify for the above rule of being considered with an 83% or higher?

 

Very verbose question. thanks.

[Locke]

Does anyone know if Dalhousie looks negatively on courses in which you did bad in your first degree? They have a stipulation saying that if you did poorly in courses, or passed with a low grade prior to the two recent years then admission will be impossible. Does that mean that it will affect how they look at your second degree? Or if you killed your second degree (no low grades) do they look at the courses only from the second degree?
 

I hope my question makes sense. 

[medhoping]

Does anyone know if Dalhousie looks negatively on courses in which you did bad in your first degree? They have a stipulation saying that if you did poorly in courses, or passed with a low grade prior to the two recent years then admission will be impossible. Does that mean that it will affect how they look at your second degree? Or if you killed your second degree (no low grades) do they look at the courses only from the second degree?

 

I hope my question makes sense.

Did you get the answer to this query? I'd love to know

[ajymtl]

Hello everyone, I have been going through this thread and it has been very helpfull so far. I do have a few questions and i would really appreciate if you guys could give me a hand with.

 

1st Bsc. GPA : 2.82/4.33

2nd degree gpa: 3.86/4.33 --> 3.74/4.0 OMSAS conversion used.
MCAT: not written yet: hopefully in September

 

I am from the province of Quebec, I would like to confirm that the information I have is correct. I have been going through the web sites of different schools and confirming with what you guys are saying here. As far as my understanding goes the school's that will leave out the 2nd gpa will be:

 

certain: Mcgill, Queen's, Northern Ontario Univeristy and University of Ottawa (last 3 years)

Unsure: University of Western ONtario, Dalhousie, University of Calgary

 

 

Could you please confirm if I will be able to apply to those universities and which ones you believe I will have a realistic shot at.

 

 Thank You

[Falling]

Western will use your best 2 full time years (30 credits) . I think the GPA cut off for Western is 3.7.

 

Dalhouse will also use your best 2 years (or best 3 if you want?).

 

U of Calgary only uses years in which you took a full course load (24 credits at least). No summer courses considered.

[ajymtl]

Western will use your best 2 full time years (30 credits) . I think the GPA cut off for Western is 3.7.

 

Dalhouse will also use your best 2 years (or best 3 if you want?).

 

U of Calgary only uses years in which you took a full course load (24 credits at least). No summer courses considered.

Thank you this helps quite a bit. 

[HousesBestCane]

Thank you so much for all the information. 

[pulsar93]

First off, thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread it's answered a ton of my questions. However there are still a few things that I have me confused (apologies in advance if these have obvious answers that I've missed).

 

Basically I'm wondering if I have to complete 2 years of the 2nd degree before I can apply to schools like Dal, Queens, UWO, and NOSM? If I apply during my 2nd year what years GPA would they look at? Yr#1(2nd deg) only or yr#1(second deg) + yr#5(1st deg)? IOW is it possible to do the 2nd degree in two years and apply during the 2nd year? If that's not possible would I be better off doing the degree in 2 years and apply once completed or just doing the degree in 3 years and applying during my 3rd year? Doing 3 years would give me a couple extra options like Ottawa and U of C (long shot) and gives me extra time to round out ECs and raise GPA if needed, but I'd rather not do that extra year if at all possible.

 

Does the same thing apply to Ottawa where they look at 3 most recent years?

 

Last question, Mcgill requires 45 credits completed before the Nov 1 deadline. However if I'm planning on doing the 2nd degree in two years does this rule make it impossible for me to apply to Mcgill until after I've completed my degree?

 

Thanks in advance. 

[Falling]

First off, thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread it's answered a ton of my questions. However there are still a few things that I have me confused (apologies in advance if these have obvious answers that I've missed).

 

Basically I'm wondering if I have to complete 2 years of the 2nd degree before I can apply to schools like Dal, Queens, UWO, and NOSM? If I apply during my 2nd year what years GPA would they look at? Yr#1(2nd deg) only or yr#1(second deg) + yr#5(1st deg)? IOW is it possible to do the 2nd degree in two years and apply during the 2nd year? If that's not possible would I be better off doing the degree in 2 years and apply once completed or just doing the degree in 3 years and applying during my 3rd year? Doing 3 years would give me a couple extra options like Ottawa and U of C (long shot) and gives me extra time to round out ECs and raise GPA if needed, but I'd rather not do that extra year if at all possible.

 

Does the same thing apply to Ottawa where they look at 3 most recent years?

 

Last question, Mcgill requires 45 credits completed before the Nov 1 deadline. However if I'm planning on doing the 2nd degree in two years does this rule make it impossible for me to apply to Mcgill until after I've completed my degree?

 

Thanks in advance. 

 

The application year GPA will not be considered unless you get conditional acceptance. I believe UWO and Ottawa will give conditional acceptance. 

[blondie777]

Hey guys,

 

So I'm currently doing a second undergrad degree after doing a physiology degree. I was curious what did most of you guys do a second degree in? I was planning on just doing general studies and trying to take a bunch of science courses but I'm not able to since my degree needs to be distinct. I was thinking about applying to a kinesiology program after this year at my school since it's still technically science courses but a different disciple. My other options are business or math.

 

I really appreciate any input/ advice you guys could give me, feeling a bit lost right now

 

Thanks in advance!

[HousesBestCane]

Hey guys,

 

So I'm currently doing a second undergrad degree after doing a physiology degree. I was curious what did most of you guys do a second degree in? I was planning on just doing general studies and trying to take a bunch of science courses but I'm not able to since my degree needs to be distinct. I was thinking about applying to a kinesiology program after this year at my school since it's still technically science courses but a different disciple. My other options are business or math.

 

I really appreciate any input/ advice you guys could give me, feeling a bit lost right now

 

Thanks in advance!

I haven't gotten to med yet and quite frankly might decide not to go that route. Either way, my 2nd UG is Law school. I had applied into nursing as well. Had applied into biomedical engineering too, + some other engineering. Have not applied into masters.

 

So, what to apply in for 2nd UG?

 

It depends on your grades. I would advise to go either into what you're passionate bout or into a field where you consider yourself naturally gifted. You didn't mention your first undergrad, but if you're like me, having done a 1st UG in biomedical sciences, learning chemical pathways may not be a passion nor a talent. I went into law because here in QC they consider your UG in the applications, so it will give my GPA a solid boost, considering the competitiveness of the program. 

 

If you consider business and math, maybe that's where your heart lies. Make sure that it's your plan B, not just another route through the forest to weasel your way into med. 

 

Lastly, don't beat yourself up if something doesn't go according to plan. Life doesn't care about our plans. So just pay attention to the raw data you have about yourself and job opportunities in the programs, and follow that path without self judgement. 

 

Cheers. 

[murrin]

Who has had success getting in purely based on their 2nd degree? I've been looking around all the success stories and accepted/rejected threads and very few accepted applicants seemed to have taken this path. Is it even realistic or does it lead you down a road of false hope? I'm about to start my 2nd degree in September and I've been sucked in to reading various forums for the last few hours. 

[rmorelan]

Who has had success getting in purely based on their 2nd degree? I've been looking around all the success stories and accepted/rejected threads and very few accepted applicants seemed to have taken this path. Is it even realistic or does it lead you down a road of false hope? I'm about to start my 2nd degree in September and I've been sucked in to reading various forums for the last few hours. 

 

I did - so there is at least one person floating around

 

The real question is why didn't the first degree work, and how has that changed.

[not my real name]

Who has had success getting in purely based on their 2nd degree? I've been looking around all the success stories and accepted/rejected threads and very few accepted applicants seemed to have taken this path. Is it even realistic or does it lead you down a road of false hope? I'm about to start my 2nd degree in September and I've been sucked in to reading various forums for the last few hours. 

 

I did too. Ended up doing a three year second undergrad (to qualify for Ottawa). I applied in my third year of the degree with a 3.95/4.0 and received interviews from 4/7 schools I applied to. Previous undergrad GPA was below 3.0

 

I know someone else in my class who also did a second degree.

 

You had better make damn sure that every other aspect of your application is top notch when you embark on this path, however. Remember that is a high GPA is necessary but not sufficient to get into med school. 

[not my real name]

I did - so there is at least one person floating around

 

The real question is why didn't the first degree work, and how has that changed.

 

This x10000

[t0ny]

Just a question for all the knowledgeable people on here: 

 

is a 3.90-3.92 OMSAS 2 year GPA for the 2nd undergrad enough for most schools? I am only IP for McGill.

 

Also, as I understand, the only schools i'd be eligible for as of today would be Queens, Western (for next cycle only), McGill, Ottawa,  Dal, Calgary. Is this correct?

[pulsar93]

Just a question for all the knowledgeable people on here: 

 

is a 3.90-3.92 OMSAS 2 year GPA for the 2nd undergrad enough for most schools? I am only IP for McGill.

 

Also, as I understand, the only schools i'd be eligible for as of today would be Queens, Western (for next cycle only), McGill, Ottawa,  Dal, Calgary. Is this correct?

 

IIRC Calgary takes your entire GPA minus your worst year, so if a second undergrad brings your cGPA up to usable levels Calgary could be an option but otherwise it wouldn't. You are correct about Queens, Western, McGill, Ottawa, and Dal however there is also NOSM that will admit based on higher of the 2 GPAs from each undergrad degree. 

 

Sask does accept 2nd degree gpa however they only do it for IP applicants and they take the last 120CU completed at the time of application. This could be an option if you were planning on taking 3 or 4 years for your 2nd degree as opposed to the more common 2 year approach as 3 years of full time study at Saskatoon or Regina would qualify you as an IP applicant for Usask med. 

[t0ny]

IIRC Calgary takes your entire GPA minus your worst year, so if a second undergrad brings your cGPA up to usable levels Calgary could be an option but otherwise it wouldn't. You are correct about Queens, Western, McGill, Ottawa, and Dal however there is also NOSM that will admit based on higher of the 2 GPAs from each undergrad degree. 

 

Sask does accept 2nd degree gpa however they only do it for IP applicants and they take the last 120CU completed at the time of application. This could be an option if you were planning on taking 3 or 4 years for your 2nd degree as opposed to the more common 2 year approach as 3 years of full time study at Saskatoon or Regina would qualify you as an IP applicant for Usask med. 

Perfect thank you for the insight. I'm actually completing my 2nd undergrad this year (did it in 2 years). 

[guitarcoffee]

Hey guys, 

 

For the schools that look at your 2nd degree, is it correct that they will all accept a 2nd degree done through Athabasca? (with the exception of Ottawa). Saw a comment on a thread that stated Dal won't accept online degrees. Thanks!

[kalmah]

Perfect thank you for the insight. I'm actually completing my 2nd undergrad this year (did it in 2 years). 

Hey man

 

For the first year of your second degree, you must be taking plenty of 1xxx and 2xxx level courses...but on the Western Medicine site it says you need to take certain year level courses

 

I'm doing the same thing you are, a second degree and i'm running into this problem. Any solution?

 

 

The first semester of my second undergrad degree is as follows

 

1xxx (ELECTIVE)

1xxx

2xxx

2xxx

3xxx

 

second semester is 

 

2xxx

3xxx

3xxx

2xxx

1xxx

 

 

does this meet the 3/5 requirement western needs?

[kalmah]

Just got an email back from Western

 

if you are doing your new degree in 2 years, they look it as you're doing a 3rd and 4th year.

 

 

So what if you need to take first year and second courses that are required...you're screwed