NeuroD Posted August 5, 2016 Report Share Posted August 5, 2016 COD put together a nice easy to understand guide for voting (with their preferences highlighted obviously). I'm really happy with their work and all the effort they've put int. Here's the guide: http://votenopsa.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/how_to_vote-_guide.pdf I really hope we get to make a stance against the government and the OMA at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeuroD Posted August 5, 2016 Report Share Posted August 5, 2016 Also, apparently I'm eligible to vote now, even though I registered on July 14 and the deadline was July 11. If others were in the same situation, check if you are not eligible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrouchoMarx Posted August 5, 2016 Report Share Posted August 5, 2016 I do realize OAP is not part of COD. I even emailed OAP asking for their position on the TPSA and it's been >1 week with no response. I am not surprised about the inaction, because like you said earlier the culture of pathology is not one that is known to make a lot of noises. However I see that as further impetus to encourage pathologists, especially pathology residents, to become more involved, not just in the TPSA, but in anything that affects us, be it resident committees, CAP-ACP, PARO, OMA, CMA, etc etc. A lot of times all it takes is one or few active individuals (eg. the leaders of COD) to awaken dormant members, especially those that were indifferent to the issue. I think pathologists lack a "businessman" mentality, whereby success for a business is not only dependent on its internal well being or internal cost measures, but also it's critical to look for new markets, expand horizons, acquire new capital , new methods of revenue etc etc. Not only that, lobbying the government for favorable regulation is also a key aspect of any successful industry. I know there are other colleagues out there who think like this, and that this is more of an "American" mentality, and it doesn't really fit with the culture of a lot of areas of medicine, or medical system in Canada. I am confident some day I will meet like minded people, be in Canada or in USA, and am confident this mentality is the one that will advance the medical profession further. i think the best chance a pathologist has to become politically successful is to leave pathology for another field. im pessimistic. pathology is too controlled by other entities to have any chance of reclaiming its professionalism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmorelan Posted August 5, 2016 Report Share Posted August 5, 2016 It is nice to have some form of a balanced perspective. It is rather strange to me exactly how hard the OMA is pushing for this deal. Never thought of that as their job but rather to just present the facts in a more objective manner. When I am getting calls at work from the President, daily emails...... If only they were this good at marketing to the public, ha. I get very nervous when someone is trying to sell something with this degree of force. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeuroD Posted August 5, 2016 Report Share Posted August 5, 2016 It is nice to have some form of a balanced perspective. It is rather strange to me exactly how hard the OMA is pushing for this deal. Never thought of that as their job but rather to just present the facts in a more objective manner. When I am getting calls at work from the President, daily emails...... If only they were this good at marketing to the public, ha. I get very nervous when someone is trying to sell something with this degree of force. Exactly how I feel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lactic Folly Posted August 6, 2016 Report Share Posted August 6, 2016 I haven't seen this post shared yet, but it is directed at the concerns of medical students and residents: http://www.carenotcuts.ca/content/studentresidentletterwebsite.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdp43 Posted August 7, 2016 Report Share Posted August 7, 2016 Why is the OMA lobbying its body so viciously? What does the OMA have to gain from this agreement? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLengr Posted August 7, 2016 Report Share Posted August 7, 2016 Why is the OMA lobbying its body so viciously? What does the OMA have to gain from this agreement? It's not the entire OMA either. Many of the specialty divisions of the OMA have come out against it. It's mostly the executive that's pushing so hard for it without really offering a good reason why. The whole situation seems really greasy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeuroD Posted August 7, 2016 Report Share Posted August 7, 2016 Why is the OMA lobbying its body so viciously? What does the OMA have to gain from this agreement? Just the top dogs, which makes it seem like they've been promised something in return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeuroD Posted August 7, 2016 Report Share Posted August 7, 2016 It's not the entire OMA either. Many of the specialty divisions of the OMA have come out against it. It's mostly the executive that's pushing so hard for it without really offering a good reason why. The whole situation seems really greasy. It got real greasy, real quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ploughboy Posted August 8, 2016 Report Share Posted August 8, 2016 It is nice to have some form of a balanced perspective. It is rather strange to me exactly how hard the OMA is pushing for this deal. Never thought of that as their job but rather to just present the facts in a more objective manner. When I am getting calls at work from the President, daily emails...... If only they were this good at marketing to the public, ha. I get very nervous when someone is trying to sell something with this degree of force. Agreed. Their "I am (not) an activist" public campaign was so...milquetoast, yet they're being super-aggressive in marketing this deal to their own membership. Where was this aggressiveness when they were dealing with the MOH? Although I was almost certainly going to vote "no" anyway, the robocalls and the telemarketing calls removed any chance of me voting "yes". So incredibly annoying!!! I refuse to buy a pig in a poke, and that's what this deal is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrouchoMarx Posted August 8, 2016 Report Share Posted August 8, 2016 By virtue of the fact alone that the oma president is a pathologist who was once involved in oap leadership, and pathologists have been professionally castrated, you should vote no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmorelan Posted August 8, 2016 Report Share Posted August 8, 2016 Agreed. Their "I am (not) an activist" public campaign was so...milquetoast, yet they're being super-aggressive in marketing this deal to their own membership. Where was this aggressiveness when they were dealing with the MOH? Although I was almost certainly going to vote "no" anyway, the robocalls and the telemarketing calls removed any chance of me voting "yes". So incredibly annoying!!! I refuse to buy a pig in a poke, and that's what this deal is. about 15 that is how many emails I have gotten from the OMA about this deal. 15. and 2 phone calls. Both at work I might add. some of those emails have been targeted directly at me as being a resident. there has been more text sent to about the agreement and why I should vote for it than there is text in the actual agreement. truth is in the end the motivation of the OMA leadership with respect to the deal is not as important as whether the deal itself is actually worth having. That being said I cannot say anyone is looking at the OMA leadership with admiration right now. Grudgingly accept this the best deal we can get, or outright reject the deal no one is singing high praise of how it was created and how the leadership operates. Hopefully we can actually resolve some of that going forward as if we don't someone get control of the situation it is going to get worse moving forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birdy Posted August 8, 2016 Report Share Posted August 8, 2016 Between all the email from the OMA and the Coallition of Ontario Doctors, I'm about ready to just block all of them. It's a constant barrage of messaging. I'm not even going to practice in this province! That said, nothing about this deal strikes me as particularly good. Having worked in government healthcare admin, a lot of it feels like the sort of 'savings' that resulted in my division ending up spending way more in other ways to make up for the fact that critical stuff was underfunded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrouchoMarx Posted August 9, 2016 Report Share Posted August 9, 2016 as expected: http://ontariopathologists.org/ontario-pathologists/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/OAP-Position-on-TPSA-August-4.pdf pathologists are pathetic. get me out of here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeuroD Posted August 10, 2016 Report Share Posted August 10, 2016 The OMA's latest e-mail is making us look even more pathetic. The OMA and its board had stooped to fear mongering. "The PSA’s impact? Stability." Who wants to have a stable crappy deal? I'd rather the crappy deal be unstable so we can get out of it. Instead the OMA wants us to feel comforted by the fact that a terrible deal won't get too much worse. And even then, only maybe, If we're lucky, kind, and polite to the government. The Liberal government is failing. They need us to be content if they have any chance of success. There is no reason to accept it. If they continue to wage a war on doctor's they'll loose the upcoming bi-elections and the general election. On top of that, we might be temporarily, partially, defending ourselves from unilateral pay cuts, but we're screwing over patients. The status quo is TERRIBLE for patients, and the governments offer is to not dip bellow the status quo by much. If you care about doctors, vote no. More importantly, if you care about patients, vote no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeuroD Posted August 10, 2016 Report Share Posted August 10, 2016 For those interested in hearing more about the issue, I found the COD's "Town-Hall" calls to be very useful. For those of you who have been receiving the emails....I'm sorry you have to see this again here! I wanted to post this here for students who may not be OMA members and haven't received the emails. You may not be able to vote, but that dosen't mean you shouldn't be informed! I recommend most people call in and hear them out. --------- Dear Colleague, Can you make our final Tele-Town Hall at 8:30pm tonight? Tonight’s call is your last chance to hear from your colleagues about our efforts to oppose the draft PSA. As always, you can ask questions about the PSA and the voting process, or just listen in. Call details: Date: Wednesday, August 10th, 2016 Time: 8:30pm (EDT) Call in number: 877-229-8493 Passcode: 115800# These calls have been a big success, with thousands participating to date. We hope you can join us, Dr. Mark Prieditis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shady Posted August 11, 2016 Report Share Posted August 11, 2016 The Toronto Star is endorsing a "yes" vote on the deal. How did the Star get involved... I'm genuinely curious. Do they always get involved in similar votes for other unions? Did they get a cash donation to voice their opinion? I'm perplexed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redpill Posted August 11, 2016 Report Share Posted August 11, 2016 Why is the OMA lobbying its body so viciously? What does the OMA have to gain from this agreement? They know that if this deal is rejected, the government will impose unilateral cuts and push through whatever they want anyway, except in this scenario doctors will have even less say in future health care reforms. With Bill 210 coming in by the end of the year, the OMA desperately wants that seat at the table. The OMA's latest e-mail is making us look even more pathetic. The OMA and its board had stooped to fear mongering. "The PSA’s impact? Stability." Who wants to have a stable crappy deal? I'd rather the crappy deal be unstable so we can get out of it. Instead the OMA wants us to feel comforted by the fact that a terrible deal won't get too much worse. And even then, only maybe, If we're lucky, kind, and polite to the government. The Liberal government is failing. They need us to be content if they have any chance of success. There is no reason to accept it. If they continue to wage a war on doctor's they'll loose the upcoming bi-elections and the general election. On top of that, we might be temporarily, partially, defending ourselves from unilateral pay cuts, but we're screwing over patients. The status quo is TERRIBLE for patients, and the governments offer is to not dip bellow the status quo by much. If you care about doctors, vote no. More importantly, if you care about patients, vote no. Haha no they don't. Public opinion may have been with the doctors before (even that was questionable), but with most of the noise coming from the most overpaid specialists in the province, the average person is really not feeling too sympathetic. All the spokespeople from COD in the news lately have been radiologists or other top earners, which makes the opposition to the deal look like greedy millionaires protecting their tax-funded salary. Combine that with the terrible state of the economy over the last few years (we'd be in a recession now if not for stupidly high real estate), and I imagine the Liberals may even get an increase in approval ratings if the PSA goes south and they can spin it properly. The Toronto Star is endorsing a "yes" vote on the deal. How did the Star get involved... I'm genuinely curious. Do they always get involved in similar votes for other unions? Did they get a cash donation to voice their opinion? I'm perplexed... Are you seriously asking why a newspaper may want to comment on an incredibly high profile vote that will be happening this weekend, one that has been in the news for the past month and has serious impacts for the provincial budget and the future of health care in Ontario? And then following that up with an accusation of bribery to one of the most highly regarded newspapers in the country? Smh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLengr Posted August 11, 2016 Report Share Posted August 11, 2016 The editorial in the Star wasn't surprising. They've been anti-physician for years and years. It's part of their strategy for marketing to their target reader population. The editorial itself was incredibly offensive. It incorrectly claims physicians are paid to prescribe drugs and then goes on to undergandedly allege physicians prescribe drugs and perform surgery because it pays money (not because it's in the patients best interest) while neglecting to talk to patients and listen to thier concerns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ralk Posted August 11, 2016 Report Share Posted August 11, 2016 Ugh... this whole thing is getting ridiculous. Read a dozen articles mixed from the "Yes" and "No" sides and they're just talking past each other. This isn't a discussion or a debate, it's a shouting match. Even when new or supposedly independent analysis is brought up, it's very shoddy. The Toronto Star article misses some very basic facts about the tPSA while advocating for a "Yes" vote. On the other side, COD touted an analysis by Jack Carr which is quite superficial while making erroneous claims about the relationship between inflation and the global physician billings cap. A major part of my concern with the tPSA is that it is designed to be difficult to understand or explain to the wider public in such a way that advantages the Ontario government in future negotiations, but you'd think those invested in the debate would more fully understand the implications, especially economics PhDs! I can't wait for this vote to be over so we can get onto the next steps, one way or another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shady Posted August 11, 2016 Report Share Posted August 11, 2016 Redpill, the teachers union strike had a huge impact on education in the province. Where was the Star's editorial recommending the memebers of the union vote one way or another to their proposed deal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shady Posted August 11, 2016 Report Share Posted August 11, 2016 Ugh... this whole thing is getting ridiculous. Read a dozen articles mixed from the "Yes" and "No" sides and they're just talking past each other. This isn't a discussion or a debate, it's a shouting match. Even when new or supposedly independent analysis is brought up, it's very shoddy. The Toronto Star article misses some very basic facts about the tPSA while advocating for a "Yes" vote. On the other side, COD touted an analysis by Jack Carr which is quite superficial while making erroneous claims about the relationship between inflation and the global physician billings cap. A major part of my concern with the tPSA is that it is designed to be difficult to understand or explain to the wider public in such a way that advantages the Ontario government in future negotiations, but you'd think those invested in the debate would more fully understand the implications, especially economics PhDs! I can't wait for this vote to be over so we can get onto the next steps, one way or another. Can't agree more. This fiasco of a process needs to end Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ploughboy Posted August 11, 2016 Report Share Posted August 11, 2016 The editorial itself was incredibly offensive. It incorrectly claims physicians are paid to prescribe drugs and then goes on to undergandedly allege physicians prescribe drugs and perform surgery because it pays money (not because it's in the patients best interest) while neglecting to talk to patients and listen to thier concerns. Agreed. I found that part of the article very offensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrouchoMarx Posted August 11, 2016 Report Share Posted August 11, 2016 I voted against the agreement . The coalition of doctors has not addressed the overvalued billing codes some fields enjoy. It's not secret that the loudest members of the c o d are the highest billers - ophthalmology and imaging. Their public outcry makes us all look greedy unless they are willing to come to the table and redistribute the fee schedule to be fairer. Had these fields considered such a move we would not be in the mess we are in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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