Need advice RE potential options moving forward

[medonedayyyyy]

 

Thank you all for your input and good luck to those with the interview. 

 

 

 

 

 

[CelluleB]

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[Médicomage]

I am in a similar situation as you, and I would choose the PhD. You're a great candidate, I think this year is exceptional, because of the pandemic and all, I believe more people have applied, but it won't be like this forever.

And a PhD is still a doctor 8).

[Al22]

32 minutes ago, medonedayyyyy said:

I have an amazing PhD opportunity lined up for the fall semester.

I am 100% biased but I would say go for it!!! 

The rejections sting a bit less when you are studying toward your PhD versus when you are doing a second undergrad, because you know you are moving foward with your life and you develop new skills, are paid, can plan an alternative career, lots of EC opportunities, etc (but again I'm super biased because I was miserable in undergrad).

Also if you speak french and are a quebec resident, at the end of your PhD you can apply in a special contingent at francophone schools and the GPA cut-off is  lower (I got in Laval with a GPA of 3.6/4) and they will look at your CV and research publications/presentations.

Just FYI I had an interview at McGill in 2017 with a GPA of 3.6 I was 1st year PhD with a Masters and 4 publications (1 first author). Then they chose to give less weight to the CV and I never got invited again... 

[medonedayyyyy]

Thank you both for your kind responses. You are also both very great candidates and I really hope you attain your end goals (I am confident you will as long as you keep trying). 

@LGMed2021 I think your path aligns beautifully with your goals. No matter what, just keep trying and do not give up. That is nice to know RE: the PhD at French schools. Because my undergrad is in psychology (3.88/4.3) I currently do not stand a chance. However, if that changes with a PhD that can totally be a great option to look at. 

 

@MédicomageI really hope you are right regarding the pandemic! But thank you. I do think the PhD may be the better option especially that I love what I am doing (vs. the undergrad in which I was pretty unhappy). 

[medonedayyyyy]

@Al22 Thank you so much ! I am so sorry about you rejections, but I am happy to read that you made it to Ulaval! Your path brought you to where you are meant to be! 

I do speak French and am a QC Resident. This really does sound like a great back up option (to apply at the end of my PhD). At least I can still keep trying at McGill during the PhD, but have even more options when I am done. 

I must agree with all your points made regarding the PhD. I too did not enjoy my undergrad and would want to avoid going backwards at all costs, unless my chances are hopeless and it is the only way to get in to med. It is just very hard to predict with this sudden increase in applicants and averages... especially with school being online, we may see an inflation in grades 

[LebRT]

1 hour ago, medonedayyyyy said:

Hi everyone,

I am in a current dilemma and would love some advice. I have been applying to medical school for 4 years now. During my first application, I received an interview invite. Based on my stats, I ranked top 20% for interview (they invited top 25%) but my pre reqs were so low that my ranking decreased and I was refused. I spent 1.5 years retaking all the basic sciences and reapplied every year since. I have not received an interview since. 

To provide more context, I am an IP and my GPA is 3.81 (which is low and makes it an uphill battle). I am currently finishing an MSc and am unsure how to move forward. I have an amazing PhD opportunity lined up for the fall semester. However, I feel my GPA may be a huge barrier (as my CV has ranked well in the past and I believe is not a weak point). RE: casper, that has been very up and down. First year, I ranked in the top 60. Second year, top 300. Last year, I was unable to obtain context on casper but my overall final ranking was between 300 and 350. 

My dream is to become a physician but I am unsure how to move forward. Should I forfeit my PhD opportunity (which would deeply pain me) to redo a second undergrad and try to improve my grades and in turn my chances at an interview? Or should I continue on with my PhD in hopes that it will improve my academic context (as well as chances at an interview), while also doing something I love, but that may not improve it enough?

Thank you all for your input and good luck to those with the interview. 

 

 

 

 

 

I remember the last time I applied to med school was in 2009. I did not get an interview and decided to pursue an undergraduate in Behavioral Neuroscience, a topic I was really interested in. Then, in 2014 I was hesitant to apply to med school again because I did not feel like I had it in me and I did not truly know what to write about in my application. I remember feeling sad seeing my friends getting into medicine. Fast forward to today, I am finishing my PhD in few months in Behavioral Neuroscience at a great lab that has given me so much potential. I just received my very first med school interview. I do not have the highest grades and I definitely do not have the same background as others, but I have gone through so much over the past years and I have truly explored the reasons why I want to pursue medicine. I know it is the right step for me and I am eager to show others during my interview what I can offer to the field based on my academic, personal, and volunteering experiences. There is no way I would have been able to do that when I was finishing my undergrad back in 2014.

So, what I can tell you my friend is if you are interested in research and a PhD, then you should pursue it. It can open so many doors for you and you will grow as a person and a scientist. If at the end of that road, you feel like medicine is truly your passion then you will find a way to come back to it and at that point you will be a much stronger candidate.

All the best to you!

[Al22]

2 minutes ago, medonedayyyyy said:

 does sound like a great back up option (to apply at the end of my PhD). At least I can still keep trying at McGill during the PhD, but have even more options when I am done. 

Also Laval lowered their cut-off for the "cote de rendement" to 31 (you can check if you reach the cut off in the table here : https://www.ulaval.ca/sites/default/files/admission/table-des-etalons.pdf )

so it might be worth it to apply next year, and once you have your Masters degree diploma you get a little bonus on your "cote de rendement"

[Elgar]

Hey Medonedayyyy, so sorry to hear about your rejection - I think everybody on this thread knows how it feels. 

I think PhD is a great path if you really see yourself as a researcher, keeping in mind that if MD doesn't work out you'll probably need to do 1-2 post-doc and that it might be difficult to find a job afterwards, especially if you find yourself bound to a city/province/country. It also depends largely on your age and life goals (ie having a house, children, etc). I've had the opportunity to start a PhD, but I didn't end up choosing that path. That being said, PhD gives you quite a good shot for med after your graduate.

Doing a second undergrad can be a good "quicker" option if you consider the French Schools as well (unlike McGill, you don't need to complete the 2nd undergrad for it to affect your CRU), which could be a good option if you find that your CRU is borderline (remember, if you graduate from MSc in the next few months you'll have +1 on your CRU for next year, at least at UdeM, I'm not aware how the bonuses work at Laval and Sherby). However, undergrad is stressful, and it can be even more stressful if you know you have to get an A+ in every course. Things to consider if you go that way: do you like the core of the program? can you perform well? what CRU = 4.3/4.3 for each school? 

Finally, if money is a concern, PhD is probably a better option since you can have nice scholarships or at least AFE financing for PhD. AFE only will give you money for a limited number of months for undergrad, so after 2 undergrads you'd probably have to live on your LOC for most of your MD - which is not the end of the world but not the best scenario!

In the end, it's a lot of gambling to be honest. I wish you all the best, and take care!

 

[offmychestplease]

doing a second undergrad is a better option...significantly faster and if you choose a good one can lead to a good job if med does not work out. Sure, the PhD sounds cooler and more prestigious but doing a PhD is career-suicide unless you're one of the lucky 5-10%...  

Even if you do the PhD (4-5 years) and then get into medicine (4 more years) that means you will start residency 9 years from now...there comes a point where you need to really do a time-effort and cost-benefit analysis..

[Al22]

1 hour ago, offmychestplease said:

doing a PhD is career-suicide unless you're one of the lucky 5-10%...  

Only if your only career alternative appart from medicine is having your own lab.

But yeah I agree that obviously it is a good idea to check what are the prospective jobs for someone with the PhD you're thinking of getting and not assume that a PhD will mean you will run your own lab someday. There are health-related job options like public health or data science that will value a PhD degree but you need to think if those are options that you would enjoy.

[medonedayyyyy]

Thank you all for your sharing your thoughts and providing me with very insightful information. It really means a lot and it is so nice to have access to such a wonderful community. There is definitely no right answer and there is so much to think about. I think both options have pros and cons and are somewhat a gamble. I am going to have to spend some time thinking about this and hopefully select the right choice. Thank you all. Good luck to those that have received the interview and never give up to those who have not.