Applying To US DO Med Schools - FAQs, Guidance & Canadian Friendly Schools

[Mashmetoo]

By "they will adjust accordingly," do you mean that I should enter all my half- and full-year courses as 3 and 6 hours, respectively, without having to worry about them assuming that I don't meet their science pre-requisites?

 

Thank you for the quick reply btw

 

Yes, 3 and 6 hours. Then add in the full course name if it had a lab or not.

[fluztom18]

Yes, 3 and 6 hours. Then add in the full course name if it had a lab or not.

 

Awesome, thank you for the clarification.

[spoudaios]

Mashmetoo... I sent you a PM

[ShootingStar]

"Your Application Has Been Verified"

 

Finally!

[Mashmetoo]

"Your Application Has Been Verified"

 

Finally!

 

O man, that took them over a month! G'luck!

[ShootingStar]

Thanks! Really hoping for Western actually... Would kill to be in Cali.

[Mashmetoo]

As a Canadian osteopathic physician with an unrestricted license in Canada since 1987 , and one who has been actively involved in obtaining full unrestricted licensure in Canada since 1979, Ibelieve I can provide some valuable insight into where the osteopathic professsion is in Canada and where it is going. I've read these posts over the past year. Although many comments are accurate, some reflect rumours as truth. As one enteres a "professional" field one must in all respect present as a professional. In no way should we be slamming particular schools, use expletive words or spread gossip that one really doesn't have the full details on. To do so only minimizes the credibility of all of us Canadians.

 

When I entered osteopathic medical school in 1979 D.O.'s in Canada were on the verge of extinction. They were limited to manipulative medicine, and there was a recent government report that indicated that Canada had too many physicians. Medical school class sizes were being decreased and access to licensure forforeign physicians was being curtailed. There was little appetite to change things for the osteopathic profession.

In spite of this, numerous letters were sent to all Canadian licensing bodies, federal/provincial governments, the Medical Council of Canada, and the Royal College of Physicians and Surgeons of Canada resulting ultimately in full unrestricted licensure in Alberta, Ontario and British Columbia.

In posts, I've noted comments at times that were derogatory to the Canadian Osteopatic Association. Let me be very clear. Essentially for most of the past 25 years, only four fully licensed osteopathic physicians have this organization alive. Although each of us has been fully licensed, with nothing to gain for ourselves we have worked hard to achieve what each of you if accepted to a D.O. school will benefit from. U.S. trained osteopathic physicians have been recognized by each of the Medical Council of Canada,the Royal College of Physicians and Surgeons of Canada the Canadian College of Family Physicians, and Carms in addition to the Federation of Medical Regulatory Authorities of Canada(FPMRAC)(composed of registrars of each provincial medical licensing authority). Things have changed. When I returned to Canada even after completing an ACGME accredited residency in Internal Medicine I had to do one year of a rotating internship. Subsequently I was accepted to a fellowship but this was rescinded after the Royal College learned about my underlying degree. Not now. You can practice in Canada now without prejudice. I have never encountered it professionally. FPMRAC as a result of the Agreement on Internal Trade has recognized the American D.O. degree as equivalent to the allopathic(M.D.) degree. This means that you will be able to practise throughout Canada fully licensed as a D.O.. Can you do this now. Not quite. Although this agreement is in place, it takes time for governments to change their legislation/regulation. In Saskatchewan and Newfoundland the registrars have bothmade written statements to this effect that once the Medical Acts are open, then these changes will be made. This does not stop one from applying though, as was done in the past and successfully so.How long will it take for these changes to be implemented? Who knows! This is where we need advocacy. Prince Edward Island, although a signature to the FPMRAC agreement fails to respond to correspondence. Otherwise throughout Canada full unrestricted licensure is available to you. The situation with regard to licensure requirements is always changing and you need to realize that one model only does not exist. You can be licensed with just an ACGME accredited residency and Comlex in Ontario as Comlex is considered an equivalent exam to the Medical Council by the College of Physicians and Surgeons of Ontario(see their policy section). However to be wise one would take the Medical Council Qualifying exams as this provides the most flexibility. The Medical Council has just re-visited in June of this year the requirement for D.O.'s to do their Evaluating Exam, the outcome of this deliberation not yet known.

Can you achieve a residency in Canada. Absolutely, and has been done. Through CARMS one applies. We are currently trying to obtain equality with our U.S. allopathic colleagues with respect to some provinces. With FMPRAC's statement of equality one hopes that the individual provinces will provide this equity. This is an on-going issue.

In the past I have read some condescending comments regarding Michigan State school just being out for the money. This is where one really needs to get the story right before one comments inappropriately. Six years ago at the inaugural meeting of the Osteopathic International Alliance in Washingto, D.C. members of the Canadian Osteopathic Association approached a number of U.S. osteopathic medical schools to see if there was interest in developing a satellite osteopathic medical school in Canada. We did this with the intent of trying to expeditiously increase our numbers. Of the several schools that were interested we pursued Michigan State recognizing its name recognition and reputation feeling that this would best help our Cause In Canada. Michigan States interest was it's status as a U.S. landgrant institution and that this fit its mandate. A steering committee was established and we met many times and are still active today. This type of undertaking takes time. Although we have met some obstacles, I don't believe these can't be overcome. Much like the work to obtain full licensure in Canada these things take time. Michigan State has agreed to accept 25 Canadians per year, not to line their pocket book as some posts have alluded to, but rather to get a jump start on a nucleus of osteopathic physicians in Ontario to jumpstart the process. This year 15 Canadians were accepted into the program even though it was started late in the admission season. In contrast to some posts implying that these Canadians were going to be delegated to a distant satellite spot, this again is not true. The Canadian students were like the American students accepted, given choices. At first we as a group of the steering felt that keeping them at one spot would promote comraderie and as such help facilitate their eventual return to Canada, a goal of the program. Some posts comment on the onerous application of Michigan State. Others comment on how ridiculous it is for other schools to ask for letters of science professors who don't really know you. In fairness to Michigan State their application emphasizes to obtain references that know you, not necessarily professors. In addition if you live a long distance away the fact that you are not interviewed saves you significant expense. Is it expensive. Yes, but so are all schools. Not being accepted could cost you one year of lost physician income, an even greater expense. In advance of someone questioning my intent, I have nothing personally to gain by correcting misinformation regarding Michigan. I just want to ensure that one has the right information.

To be sure you should apply widely. You can always turn down one school for another if you are fortunate to get accepted to more than one. Last year I told one individual to apply to a certain school as I thought that as a relatively new school the chances were probably better, although that individual was somewhat skeptical given location. I indicated that if others felt the same way that her chances were better. Needless to say that is the only school she was interviewed at and accepted. Do you need a D.O.reference? Not necessarily. As one who attends the A.O.A. convention each year and mans a booth for the Canadian Osteopathic Association I can tell you that American D.O.'s do not really know the situation in Canada. As such some committee members may question why you don't have a D.O. letter not recognizing how difficult it is for you to obtain one, and others would be very impressed that you took the effort to find a D.O. to write you a letter. Either way to me it is to your advantage to get the letter even if this means going over the border to get one. Remember you have little time and it is imperative to have your application completed as early as possible. Personally I have completed a number of these requests but it is getting harder to do all of them given the increased numbers.

To those of you that are already accepted. Now is the time to work towards making your future in Canada even better. With respect this must be done in a professional manner as now you are a professional. I believe that the Canadian students need to organize to address the issues they face, issues that are not nearly as challenging as in the past. The wheel does not need to be re-invented. Those of us who have worked so hard for your future don't want some cowboy going off on their own. We want thoughtful discussion on issues and co-ordinated planning to attack each of the issues that affect your future. The Canadian Osteopathic Association would like to help facilitate organizing the Canadian students so that we can pass the torch on responsibly to the leaders of tomorrow.

If a liaison from each school that has Canadians can be annointed and that appointee could contact the Canadian Osteopathic Association then it is my hope that we can start a Canadian Student Osteopathic Association involving all Canadian students and develop a mission,vision and strategic plan to help promote your future and those to follow you. As Canadian osteopathic students you now have the responsibility not only to be the best for your patients but also to be the best physician you can be as you will be Ambassadors of the Osteopathic profession In Canada. May your idealism of today, transcend throughout your careers.

 

Some highlights: 1) it's just a matter of time before all Canadian provinces will recognize USDOs! (Saskatchwen, Newfoundland, Prince Edward Island)

 

2) There may come a day when USDOs no longer have to write the MCCEEs!! (making us completely equivalent to USMDs)

[Mashmetoo]

Michigan State's scholarship for incoming Canadian students is $20,000.00 per year for four years as previously clarified above. For your interest, Newfoundland and Labrador have now through the Medical Act, 2011 enabled registration of American trained osteopathic physicians to their full registry. As it now stands, in Canada, the only province yet to commit itself to full licensure of osteopathic physicians is PEI. Saskatchewan has commited to change at the first legislative opportunity. Every other province has current access to full licensure for American trained osteopathic physicians.

 

Only PEI remains!

 

Don't know about you guys, but I'm PSYCHED!!

[JoshT]

First off, thank you for this thread. It has been very helpful to every Canadian who are seeking admission to D.O. schools. I have read a few pages and I have come up with some questions I just want clarification on.

 

Reading Cando's post, something confused me. "Can you do this now. Not quite. " Did he say this, in response, to provinces such as PEI and Sask?

 

Secondly, I will be applying this cycle and I have not yet completed 0.5 CHM inorganic lab and 0.5 ENG credit (I completed CHM139, CHM220, and ENG100 at UofT). How do I write in my application that the grades for these courses are pending as I will be taking them this coming fall/winter? Also, I have already graduated.

[Mashmetoo]

First off, thank you for this thread. It has been very helpful to every Canadian who are seeking admission to D.O. schools. I have read a few pages and I have come up with some questions I just want clarification on.

Reading Cando's post, something confused me. "Can you do this now. Not quite. " Did he say this, in response, to provinces such as PEI and Sask?

 

Secondly, I will be applying this cycle and I have not yet completed 0.5 CHM inorganic lab and 0.5 ENG credit (I completed CHM139, CHM220, and ENG100 at UofT). How do I write in my application that the grades for these courses are pending as I will be taking them this coming fall/winter? Also, I have already graduated.

 

Yes, he was referring to PEI, Sask, Newfoundland - the only Canadian provinces that did not recognize USDOs previously.

 

You'd need to add in a new semester (e.g. Fall 2011 - 2012), and add in the course perquisites you will take during that time (or whenever it is that you decide to take them).

[JoshT]

Yes, he was referring to PEI, Sask, Newfoundland - the only Canadian provinces that did not recognize USDOs previously.

 

You'd need to add in a new semester (e.g. Fall 2011 - 2012), and add in the course perquisites you will take during that time (or whenever it is that you decide to take them).

 

Greath. Thank you for your reply.

 

One more question about CHM credits at Ryerson. I noticed both CKCH106 and 107. I have already taken CHM139H (0.5) at UofT. Can I just take CKCH106 to fulfill my 1 credit or do I also have to take CKCH107 as well?

[Mashmetoo]

Greath. Thank you for your reply.

 

One more question about CHM credits at Ryerson. I noticed both CKCH106 and 107. I have already taken CHM139H (0.5) at UofT. Can I just take CKCH106 to fulfill my 1 credit or do I also have to take CKCH107 as well?

 

You'd need both as ckch106 is strictly a lecture course with no lab component. Ckch107 is a strictly lab course with no lecture component, so they both technically make up 1 full credit of general chemistry regardless of chm139

[ChineseKid]

anyone know of any DO/MD to shadow in the vancouver area?

and does shadowing a vet doctor counts?

[Mashmetoo]

anyone know of any DO/MD to shadow in the vancouver area?

and does shadowing a vet doctor counts?

 

shadowing a vet doc most certainly would not count unless you were applying to vet school. I suggest heading over to SDN, there are people there who can help you with shadowing opportunities.

[moo]

anyone know of any DO/MD to shadow in the vancouver area?

and does shadowing a vet doctor counts?

 

I know of at least one DO in Vancouver (I worked with him). There are also a couple I know of in Victoria. PM me if you want details.

[ShootingStar]

Got the MSUCOM secondary invite today! Was really surprised because I thought they would need my MCAT for the preliminary screening.. But guess not!

[krazykanuck29]

Geeeeeeeeeeeze. I am on page 11 of this thread, trying to work out which is the best option. It's like reading a novel. Whatever the consensus at the end, I'm probably going to have a few questions.

 

Mash, you're a legend. Expect a few Q's in the near future.

[medhelp4]

A lot of good info here but it seems that the budget is way over me...

[limoncello]

I am bit confused. There is no option for "full year" term. How do indicate that the course I took was a full year course then? using credit hours? 6 semester hours vs 3? But that means that the course still appears under for example "fall" term even though I took it in the fall and winter terms.

[limoncello]

Also, does anyone know how to enter PKINE courses (offered through York). They have grade but no credit value (appear as 0 credits on my transcript). Should I just enter them as 0 semester hours?

[ChineseKid]

shadowing a vet doc most certainly would not count unless you were applying to vet school. I suggest heading over to SDN, there are people there who can help you with shadowing opportunities.

 

but i thought SDN is mainly for ppl in the states? wouldnt i need to shadow someone (in Canada) before applying to a DO college?

[medhope2011]

Shadowing a DO as a Canadian is very important, I believe there are some in Ontario, BC and Alberta. Aside from shadowing also consider to ask them any questions you have about your chances of landing a residency in Canada, issues faced (if any), etc. Some schools require DO letters while others do not so an MD letter may do.

[fluztom18]

could anyone PM me contact info of DOs practicing around Toronto? I'm having dififculty locating DOs to shadow. Thank you in advance.

[medhope2011]

Hmm I don't think there are any DOs practicing in Toronto. There are only 2-3 in Ontario total I think, I remember reading on the forum that there is one up north of Toronto maybe 3-3.5 hours away. Contact the Canadian Osteopathic Association.

[thegame11]

could anyone PM me contact info of DOs practicing around Toronto? I'm having dififculty locating DOs to shadow. Thank you in advance.

 

There is one in Newmarket. Contact the Canadian Osteopathic Association for contact information...