Applying To US DO Med Schools - FAQs, Guidance & Canadian Friendly Schools

[ChineseKid]

when you guys say contact them do you mean just emailing them and ask for contact info?

isnt that a bit random? will they help?

[sweet star]

Hey,

 

I was wondering what are the chances of getting into a DO school with really low MCAT scores - 20R and a mediocre GPA of 3.5. What schools should I look into? Can I bank on my reference letters and personal statement/extra curriculars to get me an interview?

[deathvvv]

Your chances are not good. Getting a 20 on the MCAT shows that you dont have a firm grasp on the material. With study, 8 on each section should be easily obtainable. Rewrite the MCAT, get at least a 24 (ideally 28+) and you stand a good shot at DO schools. With a 20 MCAT, you will have trouble with the medical curriculum even if you get in.

 

good luck

 

Hey,

 

I was wondering what are the chances of getting into a DO school with really low MCAT scores - 20R and a mediocre GPA of 3.5. What schools should I look into? Can I bank on my reference letters and personal statement/extra curriculars to get me an interview?

[thegame11]

when you guys say contact them do you mean just emailing them and ask for contact info?

isnt that a bit random? will they help?

 

Just tell them you are applying to DO schools, and the schools require you to shadow an osteopathic physician. Ask them if they can connect you with an osteopathic physician near you in order to fulfill the application criteria...

[sweet star]

So, I def gotta retake the MCAT. But, if I write the January 2012 MCAT could I still apply for the 2012 cycle? Should I send in an application now with my current MCAT and GPA? Will they wait for my January results?

[mahmos5]

Hi Everyone,

 

I have recently been looking into D.O. schools and have a few questions/ concerns. My cGPA and science GPA is around 3.6, however this is because I maintained a 3.9-4.0 for the last two years and did extra courses in summer school. In first year my GPA was horrible but this is also when I took required courses such as organic chemistry, chemistry, biology and physics. I got between a C- and B+ in all these courses. I read that D.O. schools require a min. C avg between 2 organic chemistry's but mine is a C-. Does this mean I need to redo orgo? or take an additional 3rd year orgo? I'm not worried about having to do it again because I am definitely not the same lazy student I was in first year, but I don't want to have to redo courses unless I absolutely have to. Also, although my sci GPA is 3.6, I have really low marks in all my required courses from first year, will this look bad when I apply? What can I do to fix this? I am in the Biochemistry (co-op) program at McMaster university, and I did a specialization in Molecular Biology, so I have taken many science courses in which I got all A's that apply all the concepts from these courses (e.g. molecular cells membranes, advanced topics in gene expression, chemical biology, microbial genetics, genetics, microbiology, stem cell regulation and development, etc)

 

Thank you!

[deathvvv]

Well, some US schools require you to have C (or C-) at the lowest for your pre-reqs. If you got Ds in them, you have to retake. Luckily for you, DO schools will replace your new mark with your old one, so if you retake and get an A, it will show up as an A in that course (instead of being averaged to a C). But according to you, your last two years are awesome. IF you can rock the MCAT, try for Canadian schools, you certainly have a shot.

[mahmos5]

Thank you so much for replying

 

I don't have a D in any course, my lowest mark is a C- (in the 2nd organic chemistry), I thought you need a C in each individual course if it is a required course.

 

I don't know if I can apply to Canadian schools because I was in a 5 year co-op program, so it was structured like this

semester 1 semester 2

year 1 study study

year 2 study study

year 3 study work term

year 4 study study

year 5 work term study

 

so basically one of my "best years" was broken in half where I did one semester in 3rd year and one semester in 4th year because the other semesters I was working in research labs.

 

I haven't actually written the MCAT yet because I always wanted to go into research, but after a few experiences I had, like volunteering in Nicaragua with global medical training, taking a few anatomy electives and volunteering with a cooking class for adults with cerebral palsy I really love the idea of being in the health care field.

 

Well anyway I'm writing the MCAT soon and hopefully it goes well but given that I made the set decision that I want to do med fairly recently, I have a lot of things to read up on before I apply. It's a bit overwhelming the amount of information to go through and consider, but thanks so much to everyone contributing to these threads its making things soooo much easier to understand!

[donalde]

Hi,

 

This is kind of a silly question but I just want to be sure:

 

I sent my transcripts to AACOMAS in June and have been verified for a while now. I just wanted to know, do I have to send my transcripts to the individual schools as well??

 

Thanks!

[twinklystar_hp]

double post. sorry.

[twinklystar_hp]

Hi,

 

This is kind of a silly question but I just want to be sure:

 

I sent my transcripts to AACOMAS in June and have been verified for a while now. I just wanted to know, do I have to send my transcripts to the individual schools as well??

 

Thanks!

 

nope... just need to send the schools their secondaries now.. which schools did u apply to??

[donalde]

Hey!! I applied to Western, CCOM, AZCOM, DMU and Nova. Already have an interview at Des Moines and Nova. What about you???

[thegame11]

I found another individual who went to a DO school and is now doing paeds/Adolescent Medicine at UofT.

 

http://cpso.on.ca/docsearch/details.aspx?view=1&id=%2091669

 

 

"COLL OF OSTEOPATHIC MEDICINE & SURGERY" is an older name of DMU.

[Mashmetoo]

I found another individual who went to a DO school and is now doing paeds/Adolescent Medicine at UofT.

 

http://cpso.on.ca/docsearch/details.aspx?view=1&id=%2091669

 

 

"COLL OF OSTEOPATHIC MEDICINE & SURGERY" is an older name of DMU.

 

Awesome.. this aught to put to rest the fear that USDOs can only go into family medicine in Canada. Looks like he did his residency in Adolescent medicine at UofT. Also, notice how he graduated in 2006, back in those days, the policies were still pretty restricted for USDOs, and there was a legitimate fear that we could only go into FM...

 

This could be us in a couple years!!

[Mourning Cloak]

Awesome.. this aught to put to rest the fear that USDOs can only go into family medicine in Canada. Looks like he did his residency in Adolescent medicine at UofT.

 

Strictly speaking, adolescent medicine is a subspecialty fellowship. Like you say, he graduated in 2006, and registered for "post graduate education" July 1, 2009. I'm guessing he did something else for those 3 years (most logically peds residency here in Canada), and is now doing a subspecialty training at the U of T.

 

Not arguing the point - he has parlayed his DO degree into super-specialization at the U of T, so kudos to him.

 

For all you DO students, definitely check out this incredible thread involving a Caribbean "school official" who got called out by an observant moderator:

http://www.valuemd.com/university-health-sciences-antigua-uhsa/201162-program-7.html

(It gets good on page 7)

[prostatitis]

I just received an interview invitation from AZCOM. The problem is that they expect international students to have over $300 thousand in an American bank account before issuing a visa. Since bank loans are released in small increments, how does one get that much money all at once?

[Mashmetoo]

Strictly speaking, adolescent medicine is a subspecialty fellowship. Like you say, he graduated in 2006, and registered for "post graduate education" July 1, 2009. I'm guessing he did something else for those 3 years (most logically peds residency here in Canada), and is now doing a subspecialty training at the U of T.

 

Not arguing the point - he has parlayed his DO degree into super-specialization at the U of T, so kudos to him.

 

For all you DO students, definitely check out this incredible thread involving a Caribbean "school official" who got called out by an observant moderator:

http://www.valuemd.com/university-health-sciences-antigua-uhsa/201162-program-7.html

(It gets good on page 7)

 

I think this Dr. Chen D.O. vindicates what I've been saying for the past year No one ever said that you can't specialize (or do research) as a DO, what's important is for the person with the D.O. degree to pursue these things, and see just how far you can go

 

Also, the Caribbean thread is pretty hilarious, notice how s(he) began to hide behind her school's bureaucracy and started giving autonomous replies after she got called out lulz..

[Mashmetoo]

I just received an interview invitation from AZCOM. The problem is that they expect international students to have over $300 thousand in an American bank account before issuing a visa. Since bank loans are released in small increments, how does one get that much money all at once?

 

My understanding is that they just want to see that 300k in their bank account, and will swiftly return it to you. So some people borrowed a bunch of money from different sources (maybe even talk to your bank to see if they can let you have the 200k of LOC briefly), some ppl had their parents mortgage their house to come up with the money (I'm not entirely sure how that's done).. Anyhow, this wasn't really an issue when I applied 2+ years ago, I think it implies that the Canadian applicants are increasing! and they are starting to copy the USMD school model of eschew accounts...

[prostatitis]

For those who know about ATSU Kirksville. Their website says international students must have completed at least one year of undergraduate study at a US university. Does this requirement apply to Canadians?

[Ziprasidone]

For those who know about ATSU Kirksville. Their website says international students must have completed at least one year of undergraduate study at a US university. Does this requirement apply to Canadians?

 

I don't think so - I was offered an interview and I completed all my undergraduate studies in Canada.

[Mashmetoo]

http://www.do-online.org/TheDO/?p=70171

 

In learning family medicine, China reaches out to osteopathic physicians

By Daniel McCann / Staff Editor

 

In June, Royce K. Keilers, DO, and AOA Trustee William J. Burke, DO, returned from China’s Guangdong province, where they spent one week consulting with government officials on how best to incorporate osteopathic principles and practice into Chinese curricula for family physicians.

 

With an interpreter at his side, AOA Trustee William K. Burke, DO, delivers a lecture on osteopathic medicine to Chinese medical trainees. (Photo courtesy of Royce K. Keilers, DO)

 

The trip marked the duo’s latest foray to the country that has made the training of primary care physicians a priority to meet the health care needs of its 1.3 billion people. The visit, at the behest of Shenzhen city officials, also represented both an expansion and endorsement of osteopathic medicine in China, where Dr. Keilers, Dr. Burke and Ronnie B. Martin, DO, RPh, began counseling officials five years ago.

Helping hands

 

In 2006, the relief organization Heart to Heart International, which has medical missions in China, relayed to the American Osteopathic Foundation (AOF) the Chinese government’s call for help in training family physicians.

 

For decades, China had relied on minimally educated “barefoot doctors” to treat the majority of its residents in rural areas, explains Dr. Keilers, who was an AOF board member at the time. Physicians usually specialized and practiced in urban hospitals. Chinese often sought treatment in hospitals when their ailments—anything from sore throats to migraines—were beyond the scope of minimally trained clinicians. The system proved inefficient and expensive.

 

“Five to 6 million people had very little medical care, and the government determined that the only way to help them would be to broaden the base of medicine by adding family physicians,” Dr. Keilers says. “The central government issues a directive to each of the country’s 30 provinces to devise educational programs for primary care physicians.” China hopes to train 300,000 family physicians by 2020.

 

Five Chinese health officials from Sichuan province traveled to the United States in 2006 to meet with representatives of the AOA, the AOF and the American College of Osteopathic Family Physicians (ACOFP). “We told them we’ve been teaching family medicine for more than 100 years,” says Dr. Keilers, a family physician from La Grange, Texas, and a former president of the ACOFP. “They decided they wanted us to help them. So the three of us, joined at times by other osteopathic physician volunteers, have been traveling to Sichuan province twice a year since then to lecture and demonstrate OPP. We’ve also hosted two groups of Chinese visitors in the U.S. and have shown them how we train physicians in our medical schools.”

From specialist to generalist

 

Sichuan health officials have set a goal of retraining 8,000 specialists as primary care physicians. The physicians-in-training attend primary care education centers where they follow a nine-month primary care curriculum developed by the provincial health bureau. Many of the physicians being retrained have attended lectures on OPP and made rounds in hospitals with Drs. Burke, Keilers and Martin.

 

But Dr. Burke points out that he and his colleagues have played only an adjunct role in the re-education program. “I don’t think there’s anything specifically osteopathic in regard to our structural examination and treatment techniques that they have put into their curriculum,” says Dr. Burke, who planned the osteopathic medicine education presentations for the Chinese physicians. ”But they have embraced our osteopathic residency training standards, and have recognized our osteopathic medical training by granting us temporary medical licenses.”

 

The DO ambassadors’ presentations have covered the role of family physicians, the differences between osteopathic and allopathic medicine, and the osteopathic principle of considering the patient’s entire health and how family and work can impact well-being. For the most part, their classes were composed of Chinese physicians who in turn will become family medicine educators.

 

Delivering the message in China has its challenges—from securing the assistance of a Mandarin interpreter familiar with medical terms to conveying the spirit of family medicine.

 

“You can educate someone about what a family physician does, but to then teach them how to be a family physician is more difficult,” Dr. Burke says. “Developing that heart for patient care and the ability to integrate yourself into that patient’s family and life is different from their normal way of thinking and how they’ve been trained.

 

“The most effective education we provide is to role-model the behavior of osteopathic physicians as we visit patients with the students in hospitals and clinics. We will sit down with a patient, hold her hand and proactively anticipate questions the patient might have.”

 

Liu Ya was among the Chinese physicians-in-training who visited patients with Drs. Burke, Keilers and Martin. “The most important lesson of osteopathic medicine is the concept of regarding the patient as a whole,” says Liu, who studied endocrinology at Peking Union Medical College.

 

Through observation and discussion, Chinese physicians review the common ground shared by osteopathic medicine and traditional Chinese medicine. “They know that mind and spirit are very important aspects of health,” says Dr. Martin, the vice dean of graduate affairs at the Edward Via Virgina College of Osteopathic Medicine—Virginia Campus in Blacksburg. “So one reason we’ve been readily accepted there is because they see osteopathic physicians as a blend of Western medicine and the values they believe in very strongly.”

Broadening influence

 

While for the first couple of years, Drs. Burke, Keilers and Martin restricted their efforts to the Sichuan capital of Chengdu, more recently they’ve been visiting training centers in the province’s smaller cities. With each visit to the province, they’ve noted progress toward its goal of expanding family medicine. “During the past five years, we’ve seen thousands of physicians who have been retrained as general practitioners,” Dr. Burke says. “And many new general practice residency programs have opened throughout the province.”

 

And the U.S. DOs clearly see gains in Chinese family medicine: “We have seen them come to embrace what they refer to as general practice,” says Dr. Burke. “With each trip, we see how enthusiastically they work on their own and with us to transform their health care system.”

 

Dr. Keilers, Martin and Burke plan to return to Sichuan province in the spring.

 

dmccann@osteopathic.org

 

I thought this was quite interesting

[Mashmetoo]

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/arts-and-life/life/style/canadian-medical-students-in-us-to-learn-hands-on-medical-tradition--129254848.html

 

 

Canadian medical students in U.S. to learn hands-on medical tradition

 

Medical student Chris Jacob will soon learn to place his hands on patients and subtly manipulate bone and muscle in hope of relieving pain and hastening their recovery.

 

He's among 15 Canadians learning osteopathy — manual manipulation of the body to promote healing — as part of a pilot project at the College of Osteopathic Medicine at Michigan State University.

 

"This practice treats the patient as a whole being, rather than focusing on the symptoms and trying to solve what the immediate problem is," says the 24-year-old from Whitby, Ont., who applied for the program rather than less expensive Canadian medical schools.

 

The Canadians are paying about $40,000 each in annual tuition for a program some advocates of osteopathy hope will renew a form of medicine that has struggled to find its place in Canada.

 

"We essentially will be some of the pioneers to make doctors of osteopathic medicine as popular in Canada as they are in America," Jacob said in an interview.

 

In the United States, about 70,000 osteopathic physicians — who are fully qualified to practise regular medicine — quietly blend into the medical system, doing jobs ranging from primary-care physicians in inner cities to serving as team physicians for professional athletes.

 

However, in Canada the Doctor of Osteopathy, or DO, is a rarity — with only 20 licensed to practise medicine.

 

Jacob said he was attracted to the original philosophy espoused by Dr. Andrew Taylor Still, who founded the American School of Osteopathy in Kirksville, Mo., in 1894.

 

The Missouri physician focused on the musculoskeletal system, believing that pain and illness evident in one part of the human body had its origins or relationships to connected tissues, ligaments, bones and joints.

 

He advocated manual manipulation techniques — many of them now incorporated into modern physiotherapy — as an alternative or supplement to therapies such as medication or surgery.

 

Dr. Ted Findlay, a Calgary family practitioner who is president of the Canadian Osteopathic Association, says osteopathic manual manipulation is a key feature of his practice.

 

The 52-year-old doctor spends a portion of each day treating biomechanical problems such as neck and lower-back problems.

 

For example, he recently saw a 70-year-old woman with spinal stenosis — the final stages of deterioration of the discs in the vertebrae leading to painful pressure on nerve roots.

 

One option would be surgery on her spine, but Findlay first prescribes manual therapy and lifestyle changes for the patient.

 

"It might delay the day she faces surgery. ... My experience is that a good 30 to 40 per cent of patients will benefit from the manual therapy," he said.

 

During the treatment, she will lie on a table similar to one used by a physiotherapist or chiropractor and Findlay will use her legs as a lever to induce bending which helps increase the space between the vertebrae for the nerve roots.

 

It's been a long road to bring these ideas and practices back to the medical profession in Canada, he said.

 

In the early days of the movement, it grew rapidly throughout the country. By the mid-1920s, there were more than 200 American-trained osteopathic physicians in Ontario alone.

 

However, when the Ontario government removed the osteopathic physicians' ability to prescribe medication, the Canadian connection withered to today's scattered few.

 

That's going to change, predicts William Strampel, the dean of the College of Osteopathic Medicine at Michigan State University.

 

"In the 1920s there were probably more osteopathic physicians in Canada than in Michigan or the United States. You had a great out-migration of osteopathic physicians to the United States," he said.

 

By 2015, when Jacob and others are expected to graduate, a steady influx will begin going the other direction due to Michigan's training program, said Strampel.

 

"What we do is realign patients using muscle energy techniques that let the body move itself back in place," Strampel said in an interview.

 

Strampel notes there are already courses in Canada for osteopathic practitioners, who learn the manual manipulation techniques.

 

However, he says the U.S. program differs in that it is part of a full medical training.

 

A spokeswoman for the Canadian Chiropractic Association, which uses different forms of manual therapy, says her profession will welcome the new doctors.

 

"The Canadian Chiropractic Association supports patient choice and welcomes well-trained health-care providers," said Annette Bourdon in an email.

 

"At present in Canada, many practitioners with less rigorous training hold themselves out to be osteopaths and offer their services to the Canadian public. Graduates of a Michigan State University program can help to raise the standards of osteopathic care here and educate the public on what to expect in terms of practitioner qualifications."

 

Strampel argues that the osteopathic doctors are among the best-trained physicians in the world as a result of the added knowledge.

 

Even on matters as simple as a sprained ankle, their approach may differ from conventional medicine, he says.

 

While a medical doctor may prescribe taping, icing and elevation, Strampel says an osteopathic doctor will consider the next connected bone joint — the head of the fibula in the knee.

 

"I would look at your knee because nine times out of 10 you're going to upset the fibular bone at the knee and if I don't correct that your ankle will take a week longer to heal up," he said.

 

"It's not rocket science. It's all connected."

 

Findlay says that when osteopathic physicians work on a patient's body they often discover symptoms as they work.

 

He gives the example of a patient he recently was working with to manage fibromyalgia syndrome.

 

"I found evidence of a thyroid nodule that I sent for biopsy, and the results are unfortunately malignant," he said.

 

Findlay initially worked with Strampel in an initial attempt to create Canada's first College of Osteopathic Medicine for physicians through distance education based at Sarnia's Lambton College.

 

However, he says the project wasn't approved by Ontario's Ministry of Training, Colleges and Universities.

 

Strampel said the resistance prompted him to create the 25 spots for qualified Canadians at his college — one of 31 colleges that produces osteopathic physicians in the U.S.

[dds2do]

I just found this forum. I'm one of the Canadians accepted to MSU for next summer. Feel free to ask any questions about the process.

[Mashmetoo]

I just found this forum. I'm one of the Canadians accepted to MSU for next summer. Feel free to ask any questions about the process.

 

Welcome to premed101 drgioiadds/DDS2DO - it's always good to get more Canadian DO representation on here, hopefully I'll no longer be basically the only one answering questions here!

[dds2do]

I've learned a lot from this process. Feel free to PM me on either SDN (drgioiadds) or here. I found that the key to success this year was finding a school that valued my strengths. I've heard it all from "your MCAT is good enough" or "take it again to get a 26" (yes one school said that to me last year and basically discounted my 9 years of patient experience as a dentist). I did find a couple schools that really valued that aspect of my application.