Everything online

[youbesee]

We just got an email basically telling us that the bulk of our curriculum for term 1 is going to be online, including labs, CBL, clinical skills, and FLEX. Thoughts?

[Pterygoid]

im surprised CBL and labs are online. Bummer.

[MedGoldfish]

Not a UBC student, but I thought they emailed you earlier saying that it would be hybrid? Did they change their decision?

[Bruhmoment]

Honestly, I got to say as a 3rd year at UBC I find this decision quite strange, especially for distributed sites. Specifically regarding making students go to their sites for a handful of in person sessions throughout the year. There's many students that aren't from the cities that they'll be doing medical school in (especially oop applicants) that now have to go to brand new cities and basically do online school from home. Not only is it a huge waste of money for accommodation , you're not even getting a smidge of the typical med experience or have the chance for social interaction throughout the day.  I wasn't living in my current site when I started medical school, and the transition to moving and starting medical school was hard enough as it was. 

If the situation due to covid calls for online classes then that should be understandable. But then adjust the curriculum to allow students to live where they want. 

When they changed our curriculum at the end of last year to go online , they let us return home as soon as the changes were made and they stated very clearly that we would get at least a 4 week notice to return back to our site if we needed to. Not sure why they're not treating you guys similarly.

 

[Dr. Tenma]

The labs being online is quite unfortunate. Especially the anatomy labs and dissections. I was really looking forward to it. I feel like it doesn't make much sense to charge us the same for tuition since there's some pretty important components missing entirely. It made sense for the big lectures to be online but everything else? Movie theaters have opened up and we can't have CBLs and labs in person?

[ShadesofCyan]

I was pretty crushed when I saw the email today. I feel very deflated at the idea of school online and now it seems that it will be almost completely online. Earlier emails we received made it seem like they would try to have as much of the program in person as possible. They told us we had to be at our site location... I don't know why.  It seems very unfair and unnecessary to ask people to move to their site when everything is online. Moving is expensive and stressful at the best of times.

I feel guilty for being sad as I know how lucky I am to have been accepted. From chatting with other future classmates today, I think many people are feeling very disheartened right now. This is not what we have been working towards and hoping for. Many of us were so excited to be able to shadow and get hands on experience and no one knows when this will happen. I think we all should allow ourselves to be a bit sad and disappointed if that is where we are at. I think that is valid. 

All of that being said, this is an extremely challenging time for UBC and for the Medical Program (and for the world). I do not envy UBC in trying to make this work and please all involved while following public health guidelines. I'm sure they didn't want to have everything online either.

So I'm going to tell myself that this is not ideal AND this is not forever. We will have decades of amazing medical learning experiences ahead and this is just a bump in that road. 

[Dr. Tenma]

1 hour ago, ShadesofCyan said:

All of that being said, this is an extremely challenging time for UBC and for the Medical Program (and for the world). I do not envy UBC in trying to make this work and please all involved while following public health guidelines. I'm sure they didn't want to have everything online either.

So I'm going to tell myself that this is not ideal AND this is not forever. We will have decades of amazing medical learning experiences ahead and this is just a bump in that road. 

It's likely completely out of their hands and must be a pain for them. It's probably health authorities and university's own rules, directives etc. that are preventing them from having more in person instructions. Given that OAS isn't even open yet, it must be quite a hectic time for them trying to figure this all out. I never thought in my life that if the day finally comes that I am attending medical school, it would be in front of my computer in my room. I'm grateful either way, but this is unexpected. Hopefully the winter semester will be in person. 2023s already had their winter AND summer AND fall semesters get screwed up and we may (hopefully) only have to endure one semester of this.

 

 

[Bruhmoment]

The other thing that I think is an issue is them still not being clear on whether in person sessions will happen or not later in the year. I don't know any other school who wasn't made a firm decision for this upcoming semester and I don't see this as being fair to you guys to still leave it up in the air at this point. 

[yeet9876]

I’m pretty dissapointed with the news of everything online since Ubc was getting my hopes up of there being more in person learning as we are expected to go to our sites... seems odd to me that I have to move to a new city to sit in my room all day :/ I hope they reconsider this! 

[ShadesofCyan]

I think we could look at getting together in small groups on our own (following COVID guidelines of course) for CBL and to take lectures together. I think we will have to make the best of this. 

[honeybunches]

For those of you at VFMP who live in BC but are a quite a long commute away (Surrey, Langley, White Rock, even Richmond, Burnaby, etc.). Are you staying home? I have about a 1.5 hr commute (that I did for my entire undergrad) and was looking forward to finally moving.. but I can't imagine spending that kind of money now. 

[pyridoxal-phosphate]

On 7/1/2020 at 11:54 AM, UbcSci said:

For those of you at VFMP who live in BC but are a quite a long commute away (Surrey, Langley, White Rock, even Richmond, Burnaby, etc.). Are you staying home? I have about a 1.5 hr commute (that I did for my entire undergrad) and was looking forward to finally moving.. but I can't imagine spending that kind of money now. 

edit

 

 

[honeybunches]

48 minutes ago, pyridoxal-phosphate said:

Can't answer your specific question unfortunately but from what I can tell it does seem doable (although of course not ideal to commute that much). 

Not sure what the 2024 email said, but the 2023 email basically said that all VFMP activities will be online, except for MAYBE clinical skills and the family medicine office visits. Clinical skills are one afternoon a week (usually in VGH area but not always), and family medicine offices can be anywhere in the lower mainland and pretty sure it's random assignment (so in theory you could get placed near where you currently live if you're  lucky haha). I think there are only 4-5 half days of those office visits. 

Therefore, assuming these things happen in person (which they may not) the only guaranteed thing that would be in Vancouver is clinical skills, and only like one afternoon per week. As someone who never commuted far, 1.5 hours does sound very long, but if you handled it for your entire undergrad it should be doable if you are looking to save money 

 

 

Thanks for your response!

The 2024 email says that “Weeks 3 - 11 (Communication Skills) and 12 - 14 (Clinical Skills) will be delivered online.” and only week 15 will be in-person. For FM offices, “The delivery of office visits will be guided by the practice of individual preceptors, with both in person and virtual/telehealth opportunities.”

And no shadowing due to covid (this was expected but still what a bummer).

In this case, I only expect to go to campus for family practice and the one week of clinical skills. I guess I’m just upset about the experience being lost. 

[pyridoxal-phosphate]

On 7/1/2020 at 1:32 PM, UbcSci said:

Thanks for your response!

The 2024 email says that “Weeks 3 - 11 (Communication Skills) and 12 - 14 (Clinical Skills) will be delivered online.” and only week 15 will be in-person. For FM offices, “The delivery of office visits will be guided by the practice of individual preceptors, with both in person and virtual/telehealth opportunities.”

And no shadowing due to covid (this was expected but still what a bummer).

In this case, I only expect to go to campus for family practice and the one week of clinical skills. I guess I’m just upset about the experience being lost. 

edit

[Bruhmoment]

1 minute ago, pyridoxal-phosphate said:

Ya I totally understand that this experience isn't what anyone probably expected/hoped for first year medical school :(. Also, considering you commuted so much for undergrad (props to you, I honestly have no idea how you did it!) moving closer would have been an amazing experience too. 

This is what makes no sense to me though. Imagine someone having to move from Ontario to Vancouver for a potential of 4? 5? Face to face sessions in November. It doesn't make sense as to why they are doing this 

[honeybunches]

10 minutes ago, Bruhmoment said:

This is what makes no sense to me though. Imagine someone having to move from Ontario to Vancouver for a potential of 4? 5? Face to face sessions in November. It doesn't make sense as to why they are doing this 

Yea, it’s definitely worse if you’re OOP. The curriculum that was sent out only deals with term 1 though. I’m hoping term 2 is more in-person. 

[Fast_Layne]

21 hours ago, Aryanenzo said:

2023s already had their winter AND summer AND fall semesters get screwed up and we may (hopefully) only have to endure one semester of this.
 

Wait how were their summer terms screwed?

[Fast_Layne]

11 hours ago, UbcSci said:

For those of you at VFMP who live in BC but are a quite a long commute away (Surrey, Langley, White Rock, even Richmond, Burnaby, etc.). Are you staying home? I have about a 1.5 hr commute (that I did for my entire undergrad) and was looking forward to finally moving.. but I can't imagine spending that kind of money now. 

YEP I'll be staying home, not moving closer to campus. I was planning to just commute (drive) to school. I got a hand-me-down car to prepare for this Fall lol but looks like I won't be doing much driving at all

[Fast_Layne]

10 hours ago, UbcSci said:

Thanks for your response!

The 2024 email says that “Weeks 3 - 11 (Communication Skills) and 12 - 14 (Clinical Skills) will be delivered online.” and only week 15 will be in-person. For FM offices, “The delivery of office visits will be guided by the practice of individual preceptors, with both in person and virtual/telehealth opportunities.”

And no shadowing due to covid (this was expected but still what a bummer).

In this case, I only expect to go to campus for family practice and the one week of clinical skills. I guess I’m just upset about the experience being lost. 

There's also the possibility for students to visit the anatomy labs in-person! Like the lab content will be delivered online but they said it's possible for there to be extra-curricular teaching/support opportunities in-person

[struggling2getin]

2 hours ago, Fast_Layne said:

Wait how were their summer terms screwed?

FLEX experiences and most research/summer travel plans got screwed.

[hvem]

A sizable number of our classmates actually stayed at home - in Surrey, one of our classmates commuted from white rock, Richmond, Burnaby. Even prior to covid-19, many people didn't go to in-person class the majority of the week. I personally only went to class in person for 1 full  day (CBL and clin skills) and Friday only for CBL which is 2 hours max. One of my classmates only went to ONE lecture the entire year, aside from CBL & clin skills and he does very well on exams. Both of us were partnered at family practice and have gotten feedback that we both really knew our stuff. Most of our friends never went to classes, never went to labs. 

TBH we were overjoyed when CBL moved online because now we didn't need to drive all the way to school just for 2 hours of CBL 2-3 a week. 

Many people actually skipped anatomy labs and histology labs, because they were useless learning experiences tbh -- cadaver dissection sounded glamorous to me as a premed. The reality sucks because you have 5 people crowding around a small space, we can never find the structures we're supposed to find, and you're just faking your way through the lab. Every lab my group mutters that we didn't see anything and now we'll have spend the same amount of time googling what these structures looks like ---- which why we all stopped going. 

In summary, you're missing out on nothing substantial with classes moving online. You are actually BLESSED. Having everything online will save SO much commute time which help you get better work-life balance. - saved 2 hours of commute/parking every day = time to workout, spend with your girlfriend, work on extracurriculars, get glorious sleep, etc

Also: many of my friends were super happy that flex got cancelled lol. Lot of us don't like FLEX

[bruh]

4 hours ago, hvem said:

A sizable number of our classmates actually stayed at home - in Surrey, one of our classmates commuted from white rock, Richmond, Burnaby. Even prior to covid-19, many people didn't go to in-person class the majority of the week. I personally only went to class in person for 1 full  day (CBL and clin skills) and Friday only for CBL which is 2 hours max. One of my classmates only went to ONE lecture the entire year, aside from CBL & clin skills and he does very well on exams. Both of us were partnered at family practice and have gotten feedback that we both really knew our stuff. Most of our friends never went to classes, never went to labs. 

TBH we were overjoyed when CBL moved online because now we didn't need to drive all the way to school just for 2 hours of CBL 2-3 a week. 

Many people actually skipped anatomy labs and histology labs, because they were useless learning experiences tbh -- cadaver dissection sounded glamorous to me as a premed. The reality sucks because you have 5 people crowding around a small space, we can never find the structures we're supposed to find, and you're just faking your way through the lab. Every lab my group mutters that we didn't see anything and now we'll have spend the same amount of time googling what these structures looks like ---- which why we all stopped going. 

In summary, you're missing out on nothing substantial with classes moving online. You are actually BLESSED. Having everything online will save SO much commute time which help you get better work-life balance. - saved 2 hours of commute/parking every day = time to workout, spend with your girlfriend, work on extracurriculars, get glorious sleep, etc

Also: many of my friends were super happy that flex got cancelled lol. Lot of us don't like FLEX

While I appreciate that everything moving online has been feasible and even academically beneficial to the 2023 class, it's important to also understand the difference in impact these changes have for the 2024 class. Most of us are actually not so concerned with the educational experience but more so the med school experience in general. This encompasses more than just taking in info and doing well on exams. I think I can speak for most, if not all, of the incoming students that this unprecedented shift to online curriculum will undoubtedly impact opportunities to make friends, socialize and enjoy fun med related events. It's something many of us have been waiting for many years to experience, and now we will not get it, at least for the first term. This is unique to the incoming students because upper year med students have all had the chance to participate in their orientation events, made friends, and built a support network- an authentic and welcoming transition into the medical community. It makes sense that after you have all adapted to this transition, you would welcome a shift to online curriculum; most people who are already in school are pretty happy that things moved online, so it's not surprising.

[Bruhmoment]

2 minutes ago, bruh said:

While I appreciate that everything moving online has been feasible and even academically beneficial to the 2023 class, it's important to also understand the difference in impact these changes have for the 2024 class. Most of us are actually not so concerned with the educational experience but more so the med school experience in general. This encompasses more than just taking in info and doing well on exams. I think I can speak for most, if not all, of the incoming students that this unprecedented shift to online curriculum will undoubtedly impact opportunities to make friends, socialize and enjoy fun med related events. It's something many of us have been waiting for many years to experience, and now we will not get it, at least for the first term. This is unique to the incoming students because upper year med students have all had the chance to enjoy their transition into the medical career, participated in a fun orientation, made friends and had an authentic and welcoming transition into the medical community. It makes sense that after you have all adapted to this transition, you would welcome a transition to online; most people who are already in school are pretty happy that things moved online. 

100% agree with you. It's one thing for 2nd or 3rd years to move to an online curriculum and move back to cities that they've already lived in, established themselves in somewhat, and have made some long-term friends and supports. It's another thing for completely new students to move to a brand new location in a brand new program and have minimal time to interact with their classmates or the program. 

 

Speaking for myself, my best memories of 1st and 2nd year was just messing around and having a good time with my classmates in between classes and during our breaks. Yes most of us were happy with online cbl but that's also after 2 full years of in person cbl. Yes it gets old but it's also something that everyone should experience and gain things from it

[vmed88]

Anxious to be making the move from Ontario to Vancouver for only a few days of in person learning... it's going to be super isolating moving away from family and friends to sit in my room and learn online. If anyone OOP (or local!) is feeling the same, feel free to message me. We can plan some in-person social activities (following health guidelines of course) 

[MedGoldfish]

1 hour ago, hvem said:

saved 2 hours of commute/parking every day = time to workout, spend with your girlfriend, work on extracurriculars, get glorious sleep, etc

press f for all the 2024s who don't have a girlfriend/boyfriend