Applying To US DO Med Schools - FAQs, Guidance & Canadian Friendly Schools

[ShootingStar]

Spoke to Dr. David Fiddler, D.O. (practicing in Canada) this past Sunday (amazing man, willing to chat with me even on a Sunday!!) and this is what he told me:

 

As of now, DOs have full practice rights (100% equivalent to our MD friends) in all provinces & territories in Canada except for PEI and Saskatchewan. BUT, those two provinces have both agreed to sign the The Medical Act to give DO full practice rights at the next national meeting. This will be done in the near future (definitely before we graduate!). This means that DOs will have unlimited practice rights in all of Canada very, very soon.

 

As for how people view DO/MD in Canada (since we don't have DO schools), his reply was that once you're a doctor, ALL that matters is how good of a physician you are. (I'm sure this has been said multiple times, but just want to reiterate).

 

As for me personally, I am so so so stoked to be going to a DO school! I've been telling everyone about the DO philosophy & can't wait till the white coat ceremony on June 15th. :D :D

[bpatient]

^^you make me jelly^^

[teresachang]

Hi guys

I got into a DO school and I am a Canadian. I was just wondering for going back to Canada for a MD residency after doing a DO degree as a Canadian, what's the best strategy? Any current DO graduates or almost graduate willing to share their experiences?

 

From reading this forum, people have recommended us to write the Canadian boards, COMLEX, and the USMILE to be safe, but what about in terms of doing our electives and internships? Did you guys do it in Canada during the summers? How successful are Canadians DO graduates in landing a MD residency back in Canada?

 

I know that DO are "ELIGIBLE" for first round unlike IMGs, but eligible doesn't mean they will get it due to the unknown nature of DO still in Canada to residency directors. It would be good to know where all the Canadian DO graduates have ended up? US or Canada and if US, how easy is it to stay there for a MD residency and subsequently to practice at hospital. Are there any states which are hard to Canadians to stay in? Thanks so much.

[Mashmetoo]

Hi guys

I got into a DO school and I am a Canadian. I was just wondering for going back to Canada for a MD residency after doing a DO degree as a Canadian, what's the best strategy? Any current DO graduates or almost graduate willing to share their experiences?

 

From reading this forum, people have recommended us to write the Canadian boards, COMLEX, and the USMILE to be safe, but what about in terms of doing our electives and internships? Did you guys do it in Canada during the summers? How successful are Canadians DO graduates in landing a MD residency back in Canada?

 

I know that DO are "ELIGIBLE" for first round unlike IMGs, but eligible doesn't mean they will get it due to the unknown nature of DO still in Canada to residency directors. It would be good to know where all the Canadian DO graduates have ended up? US or Canada and if US, how easy is it to stay there for a MD residency and subsequently to practice at hospital. Are there any states which are hard to Canadians to stay in? Thanks so much.

 

Take all your board exams, take your MCCEE at the end of 3rd year. Set up elective rotations in Canada in the end of 3rd year if possible, or beginning of 4th year. Get good LOCs from Canadian docs in elective rotations. Apply, and see the results

 

You won't have summers after 2nd year. Get electives in Canada - it's your only shot.

 

How successful are Canadian DOs in getting Canadian residencies? - the numbers are so small as to be insignificant. I know 1 guy who got into a Canadian residency, but my n=1.

 

I also wouldn't presume that PDs don't know anything about USDOs, the guy I know got all sorts of Canadian interviews.

 

Hard to make it on the West Coast, easier in the mid west, east coast.

 

The new wave of Canadian DO students (i.e., post 2010) all seem to want to return to Canada. The older cohort of Canadians seem to want to stay in the US. I've seen/heard Canadian DOs make it both in the US and Canada. Upt o you really.

[marcel]

do all DO schools require the MCAT?

[teresachang]

Thanks. How easy is it to stay in the US for MD residencies then as a Canadian? I am just scared to be stuck in no man's land especially with the debt I will be taking on....Why is it easier in the east coast than the west coast?

 

Are you going into 3rd year? mind sharing your plans?

 

 

Take all your board exams, take your MCCEE at the end of 3rd year. Set up elective rotations in Canada in the end of 3rd year if possible, or beginning of 4th year. Get good LOCs from Canadian docs in elective rotations. Apply, and see the results

 

You won't have summers after 2nd year. Get electives in Canada - it's your only shot.

 

How successful are Canadian DOs in getting Canadian residencies? - the numbers are so small as to be insignificant. I know 1 guy who got into a Canadian residency, but my n=1.

 

I also wouldn't presume that PDs don't know anything about USDOs, the guy I know got all sorts of Canadian interviews.

 

Hard to make it on the West Coast, easier in the mid west, east coast.

 

The new wave of Canadian DO students (i.e., post 2010) all seem to want to return to Canada. The older cohort of Canadians seem to want to stay in the US. I've seen/heard Canadian DOs make it both in the US and Canada. Upt o you really.

[Mashmetoo]

Thanks. How easy is it to stay in the US for MD residencies then as a Canadian? I am just scared to be stuck in no man's land especially with the debt I will be taking on....Why is it easier in the east coast than the west coast?

 

Are you going into 3rd year? mind sharing your plans?

 

That depends on your residency. If you want FM, IM, Peds, the primary care - shouldn't be too hard on the East Coast/ mid west as a Canadian. East is easier than west because there's simply more residencies on the East coast - also traditionally IMG heavy - so you are basically competing against IMGs in these Eastern sites - and simply by virtue of your AMG status, you'll get an easier time than the IMGs.

 

If you want surgery, neuro, derm - that's a whole new ball game.

 

To minimize risk is to set your sights lower. I've said this before - instead of gunning for that orthopedic/dermatology dual residency as a foreigner studying in a DO school, it will make things easier if you chose something less competitive - basically primary care.

 

My plan is to deal with the situation as it arises, nothing is set in stone.

[Mashmetoo]

do all DO schools require the MCAT?

 

Yes. All do require it.

[Patrick1234]

Take all your board exams, take your MCCEE at the end of 3rd year. Set up elective rotations in Canada in the end of 3rd year if possible, or beginning of 4th year. Get good LOCs from Canadian docs in elective rotations. Apply, and see the results

 

You won't have summers after 2nd year. Get electives in Canada - it's your only shot.

 

How successful are Canadian DOs in getting Canadian residencies? - the numbers are so small as to be insignificant. I know 1 guy who got into a Canadian residency, but my n=1.

 

I also wouldn't presume that PDs don't know anything about USDOs, the guy I know got all sorts of Canadian interviews.

 

Hard to make it on the West Coast, easier in the mid west, east coast.

 

The new wave of Canadian DO students (i.e., post 2010) all seem to want to return to Canada. The older cohort of Canadians seem to want to stay in the US. I've seen/heard Canadian DOs make it both in the US and Canada. Upt o you really.

 

By east coast, what type of cities/states are you referring too? like mostly rural places?

Also, if we are ok with staying in the states, how easy is it for Canadians to stay in the US for MD residencies and opening up clinics? Thanks!

[Mashmetoo]

By east coast, what type of cities/states are you referring too? like mostly rural places?

Also, if we are ok with staying in the states, how easy is it for Canadians to stay in the US for MD residencies and opening up clinics? Thanks!

 

New York, New Jersey mostly, pretty IMG heavy. Not mostly rural, lots of cities. Although if you wanted rural, I'm sure there'll be opportunities there too.

 

Ease of staying depends on your board scores, school you went, how well you performed in your clinical rotations, residencies you want and a myriad of other variables. Will be different for each person.

 

Opening up your own clinic implies you want FM, FM is usually the easiest fall back for everyone, so, not too hard I'd imagine.

[Patrick1234]

That's good to know. I was worried about the whole visa issue being a Canadian in terms of being able to stay there and do residency and even afterwards ie. hospitals would have to pay to sponsor you? so they would prefer people who don't need a visa especially if you are a DO switching to do a MD residency. (assuming board scores and everything else being equal of course).

 

New York, New Jersey mostly, pretty IMG heavy. Not mostly rural, lots of cities. Although if you wanted rural, I'm sure there'll be opportunities there too.

 

Ease of staying depends on your board scores, school you went, how well you performed in your clinical rotations, residencies you want and a myriad of other variables. Will be different for each person.

 

Opening up your own clinic implies you want FM, FM is usually the easiest fall back for everyone, so, not too hard I'd imagine.

[jawad12ca]

Hello,

I'm a 4th year Canadian student at MSUCOM. I do want to come back to Canada but after completing my residency in the US. Now from what i understand we have to do the MCCEE, MCQ1, MCQ2. Is there any word of whether the MCCEE will get waived for us in the future? I do know that if you are board certified however you are waived from the MCCEE. Any clarifications on this would be helpful.

Thanks

[Mashmetoo]

Hello,

I'm a 4th year Canadian student at MSUCOM. I do want to come back to Canada but after completing my residency in the US. Now from what i understand we have to do the MCCEE, MCQ1, MCQ2. Is there any word of whether the MCCEE will get waived for us in the future? I do know that if you are board certified however you are waived from the MCCEE. Any clarifications on this would be helpful.

Thanks

 

Just read the newest document from MCC. They do not plan on waiving the MCCEE for USDOs anytime soon. We anticipate the earliest time to revisit this problem is in 5 years, when there are more Canadian DO graduates.

 

If you already have a residency from the US, then the MCC may consider waiving the MCCEE for you to take the QEs. But then, without the MCCEE in the first place, you cannot apply to Canadian residencies.

[azerone]

I just finished my third year at UofT St.George and my cGPA is about 2.0 (really messed up 1st/2nd year). I am planning on taking the MCAT mid July (is that too late?). What are my chances on getting into a DO program?

Are there any other carrer paths that I could take with such a low gpa? At this point I have absolutely no idea as to where I will be next year by this time.

[Mashmetoo]

I just finished my third year at UofT St.George and my cGPA is about 2.0 (really messed up 1st/2nd year). I am planning on taking the MCAT mid July (is that too late?). What are my chances on getting into a DO program?

Are there any other carrer paths that I could take with such a low gpa? At this point I have absolutely no idea as to where I will be next year by this time.

 

I don't think your issue is with a late MCAT. Even if you scored a 44T, with a 2.0 cGPA, no US/CAN MD/DO school is going to take you... You are either looking at some Caribbean option, or many more years of undergrad to bring up your cGPA to at least a 3.0 to have any shot at all for a US/CAN school.

[ShootingStar]

I just finished my third year at UofT St.George and my cGPA is about 2.0 (really messed up 1st/2nd year). I am planning on taking the MCAT mid July (is that too late?). What are my chances on getting into a DO program?

Are there any other carrer paths that I could take with such a low gpa? At this point I have absolutely no idea as to where I will be next year by this time.

 

Perhaps try to do a masters or second bachelors? I know that the msu entrance cGPA average was 3.6/3.7 for the past few years just as a reference. 2.0 is far too low for any medical schools in north America.

[Robin Hood]

I just finished my third year at UofT St.George and my cGPA is about 2.0 (really messed up 1st/2nd year). I am planning on taking the MCAT mid July (is that too late?). What are my chances on getting into a DO program?

Are there any other carrer paths that I could take with such a low gpa? At this point I have absolutely no idea as to where I will be next year by this time.

 

Only a crappy school will accept you. Do you really think any serious med school can take someone with such a GPA?

Also, you should reflect on why is your GPA that low? If it wasn't extenuing circumpstances (like illness), then maybe you would be better looking at reality in face, and admitting that you most likely are not cut for med school.

[tupacandbiggie]

Only a crappy school will accept you. Do you really think any serious med school can take someone with such a GPA?

Also, you should reflect on why is your GPA that low? If it wasn't extenuing circumpstances (like illness), then maybe you would be better looking at reality in face, and admitting that you most likely are not cut for med school.

 

U mean Caribbean schools?

[Robin Hood]

U mean Caribbean schools?

 

I don't know their application stats, but I once read a post by Mashmetoo saying that someone got into Ross with a 2.2.

[bpatient]

Get to a 3.0 at the minimum, then depending on your mcat you can try for an SMP then med school afterwards.

[Robin Hood]

Get to a 3.0 at the minimum, then depending on your mcat you can try for an SMP then med school afterwards.

 

That if you have the money for an SMP.

[azerone]

Is it possible to do a masters with such a low gpa?

[Mashmetoo]

Is it possible to do a masters with such a low gpa?

 

You have to understand how bad a 2.0 looks. You are basically 1 step away from a complete fail. Regular masters programs usually have at least a B- to B+ average cGPA requirement. SMP programs are for people with weak cGPA and want to prove that they can make it in Med school (high 2s, low 3s).

 

A 3.0 is considered very low in the pre-med world, and you'd need something like a high 2, and low 3.0 to have a shot at a SMP program.

 

Unfortunately, the hard cold fact is that you won't get much from a 2.0, all the doors are basically shut, except maybe Ross, or some random Caribbean school. This, or you can spent a few more years to bring up your cGPA. But then, do the math, if you have a 2.0 after 3 years of undergrad already, how many more years of undergrad do you need to bring your cGPA up to a 3.0?

 

Assuming you get a 4.0 each year, you'd need... [2(3)+4X] / (3+X) = 3.0, X = 3 years, to get to a 3.0, and that's assuming you get a 4.0 every year at UofT no less.

[boobiman]

Mash is right. I dont want to be offensive, but i think you should reconsider medicine and why you got such low marks in the first place ( was it family reasons, financial problems etc). I know several people that are complete slackers and even they manage a 2.7 ish quite easily. Think hard and long before you jump the boat over to the caribbean.

Goodluck

[Robin Hood]

Is it possible to do a masters with such a low gpa?

 

The only thing you could do is trying to raise your GPA and apply to Queen/Western, but going from a 2.0 to a 3.8-3.9 doesn't happen overnight, it will take time. You should also reflect on why you did so bad, maybe you're just not cut for med school (unless you had some real extenuing circumpstances).